From waresound at msn.com Tue Apr 4 07:37:40 2023 From: waresound at msn.com (Nick Ware) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 12:37:40 +0000 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare Message-ID: I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. And then the fun started! We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. Cheers, N. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad From plowmandave44 at gmail.com Tue Apr 4 07:55:39 2023 From: plowmandave44 at gmail.com (Dave Plowman) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 13:55:39 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7737bbee-81a8-e6bb-9232-50860d3833f2@gmail.com> My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly. They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: > I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. > Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. > And then the fun started! > We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. > Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. > ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. > Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. > On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. > Cheers, > N. > Nick Ware - sent from my iPad -- Dave Plowman London, SW From waresound at msn.com Tue Apr 4 08:48:57 2023 From: waresound at msn.com (Nick Ware) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 13:48:57 +0000 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: <7737bbee-81a8-e6bb-9232-50860d3833f2@gmail.com> References: <7737bbee-81a8-e6bb-9232-50860d3833f2@gmail.com> Message-ID: Ours was corroded old copper all the way. At best 16 Mb/sec down and 2 up, and often nothing at all, and was sold as ?faster fibre? for ?34 per month. With Box I could have 1Gb/sec up and down for that amount, but don?t have a need for it. Cheers, Nick. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad > On 4 Apr 2023, at 13:56, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: > > ?My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly. They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. > >> On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >> I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. >> Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. >> And then the fun started! >> We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. >> Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. >> ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. >> Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. >> On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. >> Cheers, >> N. >> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad > > -- > Dave Plowman > London, SW > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From hughsnape at talktalk.net Tue Apr 4 09:05:54 2023 From: hughsnape at talktalk.net (Hugh Snape) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 15:05:54 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: <7737bbee-81a8-e6bb-9232-50860d3833f2@gmail.com> Message-ID: As a disgruntled, long term, TalkTalk customer I would consider Box but unfortunately its service isn?t available in South Devon. NB, our speeds with TalkTalk are quite good 69.8 down, 13.5 up, but a bit variable, the problems arrive if there?s a fault when TT is an absolute pain to deal with . . . Hugh Snape > On 4 Apr 2023, at 14:48, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: > > Ours was corroded old copper all the way. At best 16 Mb/sec down and 2 up, and often nothing at all, and was sold as ?faster fibre? for ?34 per month. With Box I could have 1Gb/sec up and down for that amount, but don?t have a need for it. > Cheers, > Nick. > Nick Ware - sent from my iPad > >> On 4 Apr 2023, at 13:56, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: >> >> ?My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly. They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. >> >>> On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >>> I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. >>> Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. >>> And then the fun started! >>> We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. >>> Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. >>> ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. >>> Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. >>> On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. >>> Cheers, >>> N. >>> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >> >> -- >> Dave Plowman >> London, SW >> >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From dave at davesound.co.uk Tue Apr 4 09:11:25 2023 From: dave at davesound.co.uk (Dave Plowman) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 15:11:25 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: <7737bbee-81a8-e6bb-9232-50860d3833f2@gmail.com> Message-ID: <260f19ab-a037-4a67-eafc-8c03a9a74a59@davesound.co.uk> I'm only about a couple of hundred yards to the green cabinet, and Open Reach replaced my local cable fairly recently. The beauty of having it go to a telegraph pole in the street. On 04/04/2023 14:48, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: > Ours was corroded old copper all the way. At best 16 Mb/sec down and 2 up, and often nothing at all, and was sold as ?faster fibre? for ?34 per month. With Box I could have 1Gb/sec up and down for that amount, but don?t have a need for it. > Cheers, > Nick. > Nick Ware - sent from my iPad > >> On 4 Apr 2023, at 13:56, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: >> >> ?My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly. They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. >> >>> On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >>> I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. >>> Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. >>> And then the fun started! >>> We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. >>> Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. >>> ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. >>> Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. >>> On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. >>> Cheers, >>> N. >>> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >> -- >> Dave Plowman >> London, SW >> >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -- Dave P London SW From barry-wilkinson at sky.com Tue Apr 4 09:17:36 2023 From: barry-wilkinson at sky.com (B Wilkinson) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 15:17:36 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <563E761E-1824-4CF0-A1CD-10E1D3062335@sky.com> I have found Sky to be good to deal with. UK based help lines as well and generally reliable service passed on to Openreach if a problem I have overhead copper cables but there is an un accessible green fibre box about half a mile away where the copper cables are connected. I get around 36 Mb/sec download and about 8 upload. We run Sky Q off that very well. Lots more stuff on Sky TV now comes via downloads. Unlimited data as well which is essential for the TV set up. Sent from my iPad > On 4 Apr 2023, at 15:06, Hugh Snape via Tech1 wrote: > > ?As a disgruntled, long term, TalkTalk customer I would consider Box but unfortunately its service isn?t available in South Devon. > > NB, our speeds with TalkTalk are quite good 69.8 down, 13.5 up, but a bit variable, the problems arrive if there?s a fault when TT is an absolute pain to deal with . . . > > Hugh Snape > >> On 4 Apr 2023, at 14:48, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >> >> Ours was corroded old copper all the way. At best 16 Mb/sec down and 2 up, and often nothing at all, and was sold as ?faster fibre? for ?34 per month. With Box I could have 1Gb/sec up and down for that amount, but don?t have a need for it. >> Cheers, >> Nick. >> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >> >>>> On 4 Apr 2023, at 13:56, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: >>> >>> ?My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly. They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. >>> >>>> On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >>>> I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. >>>> Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. >>>> And then the fun started! >>>> We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. >>>> Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. >>>> ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. >>>> Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. >>>> On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. >>>> Cheers, >>>> N. >>>> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >>> >>> -- >>> Dave Plowman >>> London, SW >>> >>> -- >>> Tech1 mailing list >>> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >>> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From plowmandave44 at gmail.com Tue Apr 4 09:18:04 2023 From: plowmandave44 at gmail.com (Dave Plowman) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 15:18:04 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Life Lines Message-ID: A new series just started on R4 today. Basically, a day in the life of a 999 operator, and everything as heard from her end. Phone calls in and RT to the emergency services. Not a drama that would work on TV, but brilliant radio. Worth the licence fee just for this sort of thing. -- Dave Plowman London, SW From ohbytheway.tv at gmail.com Tue Apr 4 15:33:34 2023 From: ohbytheway.tv at gmail.com (ohbytheway.tv at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 21:33:34 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: <7737bbee-81a8-e6bb-9232-50860d3833f2@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001d96734$bab16ad0$30144070$@gmail.com> Try Jurassic Fibre if they are in your area. Very fast and great service Dave D -----Original Message----- From: Tech1 On Behalf Of Hugh Snape via Tech1 Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2023 3:06 PM To: Nick Ware Cc: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk; Dave Plowman Subject: Re: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare As a disgruntled, long term, TalkTalk customer I would consider Box but unfortunately its service isn?t available in South Devon. NB, our speeds with TalkTalk are quite good 69.8 down, 13.5 up, but a bit variable, the problems arrive if there?s a fault when TT is an absolute pain to deal with . . . Hugh Snape > On 4 Apr 2023, at 14:48, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: > > Ours was corroded old copper all the way. At best 16 Mb/sec down and 2 up, and often nothing at all, and was sold as ?faster fibre? for ?34 per month. With Box I could have 1Gb/sec up and down for that amount, but don?t have a need for it. > Cheers, > Nick. > Nick Ware - sent from my iPad > >> On 4 Apr 2023, at 13:56, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: >> >> ?My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly. They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. >> >>> On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >>> I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. >>> Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. >>> And then the fun started! >>> We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. >>> Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. >>> ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. >>> Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. >>> On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. >>> Cheers, >>> N. >>> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >> >> -- >> Dave Plowman >> London, SW >> >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From Waresound at msn.com Tue Apr 4 16:22:25 2023 From: Waresound at msn.com (Nick Ware) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 21:22:25 +0000 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: <7737bbee-81a8-e6bb-9232-50860d3833f2@gmail.com> Message-ID: The trouble with TalkTalk is that the one thing you can?t do is TalkTo them! N. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad > On 4 Apr 2023, at 15:05, Hugh Snape wrote: > > ?As a disgruntled, long term, TalkTalk customer I would consider Box but unfortunately its service isn?t available in South Devon. > > NB, our speeds with TalkTalk are quite good 69.8 down, 13.5 up, but a bit variable, the problems arrive if there?s a fault when TT is an absolute pain to deal with . . . > > Hugh Snape > >> On 4 Apr 2023, at 14:48, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >> >> Ours was corroded old copper all the way. At best 16 Mb/sec down and 2 up, and often nothing at all, and was sold as ?faster fibre? for ?34 per month. With Box I could have 1Gb/sec up and down for that amount, but don?t have a need for it. >> Cheers, >> Nick. >> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >> >>>> On 4 Apr 2023, at 13:56, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: >>> >>> ?My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly. They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. >>> >>>> On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >>>> I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. >>>> Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. >>>> And then the fun started! >>>> We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. >>>> Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. >>>> ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. >>>> Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. >>>> On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. >>>> Cheers, >>>> N. >>>> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >>> >>> -- >>> Dave Plowman >>> London, SW >>> >>> -- >>> Tech1 mailing list >>> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >>> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > From peter.fox at zero51.force9.co.uk Tue Apr 4 16:37:58 2023 From: peter.fox at zero51.force9.co.uk (Peter Fox) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 22:37:58 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Open Reach have been busy festooning our telegraph poles with fibre break-out boxes. I haven't noticed anyone changing overhead cables yet (for fttp) but as BT are planning to ditch copper everywhere by 2024 (allegedly) I guess its going to happen to all of us before too long. And maybe HS2 will reach Euston before it sinks beneath the waves Peter Fox On 4 Apr 2023, at 22:22, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: ?The trouble with TalkTalk is that the one thing you can?t do is TalkTo them! N. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad > On 4 Apr 2023, at 15:05, Hugh Snape wrote: > > ?As a disgruntled, long term, TalkTalk customer I would consider Box but unfortunately its service isn?t available in South Devon. > > NB, our speeds with TalkTalk are quite good 69.8 down, 13.5 up, but a bit variable, the problems arrive if there?s a fault when TT is an absolute pain to deal with . . . > > Hugh Snape > >> On 4 Apr 2023, at 14:48, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >> >> Ours was corroded old copper all the way. At best 16 Mb/sec down and 2 up, and often nothing at all, and was sold as ?faster fibre? for ?34 per month. With Box I could have 1Gb/sec up and down for that amount, but don?t have a need for it. >> Cheers, >> Nick. >> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >> >>>> On 4 Apr 2023, at 13:56, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: >>> >>> ?My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. >>> >>>> On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >>>> I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. >>>> Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. >>>> And then the fun started! >>>> We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. >>>> Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. >>>> ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. >>>> Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. >>>> On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. >>>> Cheers, >>>> N. >>>> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >>> >>> -- >>> Dave Plowman >>> London, SW >>> >>> -- >>> Tech1 mailing list >>> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >>> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From hughsnape at talktalk.net Tue Apr 4 17:35:39 2023 From: hughsnape at talktalk.net (Hugh Snape) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 23:35:39 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3D3D90F7-9352-4212-A223-6170447D6EBC@talktalk.net> Yes, same here and I?m amazed at how crudely some of the work?s been done, many of the breakouts strapped to the poles are easy to reach from the ground and look pretty vulnerable. Sadly Jurrasic Fibre hasn?t made its way here yet . . . Hugh Snape > On 4 Apr 2023, at 22:38, Peter Fox via Tech1 wrote: > ?Open Reach have been busy festooning our telegraph poles with fibre break-out boxes. I haven't noticed anyone changing overhead cables yet (for fttp) but as BT are planning to ditch copper everywhere by 2024 (allegedly) I guess its going to happen to all of us before too long. > And maybe HS2 will reach Euston before it sinks beneath the waves > > Peter Fox > > On 4 Apr 2023, at 22:22, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: > > ?The trouble with TalkTalk is that the one thing you can?t do is TalkTo them! > N. > Nick Ware - sent from my iPad > >> On 4 Apr 2023, at 15:05, Hugh Snape wrote: >> >> ?As a disgruntled, long term, TalkTalk customer I would consider Box but unfortunately its service isn?t available in South Devon. >> >> NB, our speeds with TalkTalk are quite good 69.8 down, 13.5 up, but a bit variable, the problems arrive if there?s a fault when TT is an absolute pain to deal with . . . >> >> Hugh Snape >> >>> On 4 Apr 2023, at 14:48, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >>> Ours was corroded old copper all the way. At best 16 Mb/sec down and 2 up, and often nothing at all, and was sold as ?faster fibre? for ?34 per month. With Box I could have 1Gb/sec up and down for that amount, but don?t have a need for it. >>> Cheers, >>> Nick. >>> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >>>>> On 4 Apr 2023, at 13:56, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: >>>> ?My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. >>>>> On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >>>>> I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. >>>>> Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. >>>>> And then the fun started! >>>>> We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. >>>>> Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. >>>>> ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. >>>>> Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. >>>>> On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> N. >>>>> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >>>> -- >>>> Dave Plowman >>>> London, SW >>>> -- >>>> Tech1 mailing list >>>> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >>>> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk >>> -- >>> Tech1 mailing list >>> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >>> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Tue Apr 4 17:52:15 2023 From: paul at pgtmedia.co.uk (paul at pgtmedia.co.uk) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 23:52:15 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <009501d96748$1a003df0$4e00b9d0$@pgtmedia.co.uk> Hi Pete, I believe BT Open Reach target for all SIP / VOIP phones has slipped to December 2025 already, although they are pressing ahead with it as are Virgin Media. I get my services from Virgin and had a line issue with my Land Line a couple of weeks ago. The engineer told me they were rolling the new SIP/ VOIP phones area by area and my area was due in a few months' time. As a result, I had my 'upgrade' there and then as it would save me a visit in a few months and he was not re run the cable just for a few weeks. About 10mins and all was sorted on the new system. Only downside is your home power goes off so does your phone (As its not powered from the exchange now - no reduction in price even though they are no longer powering it!) If you ask for a back up they will provide a battery backed phone which uses a SIM if the line goes. No charge , but you have to ask. Your own mobile is probably a better back up. I did ask for there back up, but looking at the size, put it back in its box and away. I suspect if you have a Burglar alarm/ panic alarm or medical emergency alarm on your current phone, you could be in to a world of pain to swap over. Paul Paul Thackray PGT Media Consulting Ltd. +44 7802 243979 Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ -----Original Message----- From: Tech1 On Behalf Of Peter Fox via Tech1 Sent: 04 April 2023 22:38 To: Nick Ware Cc: Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk; Hugh Snape Subject: Re: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare Open Reach have been busy festooning our telegraph poles with fibre break-out boxes. I haven't noticed anyone changing overhead cables yet (for fttp) but as BT are planning to ditch copper everywhere by 2024 (allegedly) I guess its going to happen to all of us before too long. And maybe HS2 will reach Euston before it sinks beneath the waves Peter Fox On 4 Apr 2023, at 22:22, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: ?The trouble with TalkTalk is that the one thing you can?t do is TalkTo them! N. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad > On 4 Apr 2023, at 15:05, Hugh Snape wrote: > > ?As a disgruntled, long term, TalkTalk customer I would consider Box but unfortunately its service isn?t available in South Devon. > > NB, our speeds with TalkTalk are quite good 69.8 down, 13.5 up, but a bit variable, the problems arrive if there?s a fault when TT is an absolute pain to deal with . . . > > Hugh Snape > >> On 4 Apr 2023, at 14:48, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >> >> Ours was corroded old copper all the way. At best 16 Mb/sec down and 2 up, and often nothing at all, and was sold as ?faster fibre? for ?34 per month. With Box I could have 1Gb/sec up and down for that amount, but don?t have a need for it. >> Cheers, >> Nick. >> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >> >>>> On 4 Apr 2023, at 13:56, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: >>> >>> ?My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. >>> >>>> On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >>>> I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. >>>> Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. >>>> And then the fun started! >>>> We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. >>>> Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. >>>> ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. >>>> Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. >>>> On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. >>>> Cheers, >>>> N. >>>> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >>> >>> -- >>> Dave Plowman >>> London, SW >>> >>> -- >>> Tech1 mailing list >>> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >>> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From alanaudio at me.com Tue Apr 4 17:52:13 2023 From: alanaudio at me.com (Alan Taylor) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 23:52:13 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Openreach have fitted a fibre breakout box to the pole feeding our house and we have opted to have fttp as soon as possible. For various reasons, our house interior doesn?t really lend itself to running the cables at floor level or ceiling level to the ONT, which I want installed in the cupboard under the stairs, putting it out of sight, but still easily accessible and conveniently close to the WiFi router, NAS and network extender. The neatest option would be to run the fibre through the ceiling space. It?s not a trivial job and I don?t imagine that Openreach would be prepared to go to that much trouble themselves, but I could drill through the outer wall and put in a draw cable through the ceiling to where it needs to emerge. They should then be able to use it to pull the fibre through. It?s not something I would want to do unless they will use it because it involves lifting part of the upstairs floor and making two large holes in and then making good the plasterboard ceiling in the hall. Does anybody know whether Openreach would agree to me doing this and what diameter the sheathed fibre is? I?ve been looking out for any Openreach guys doing installations in the village in order to ask them, but haven?t spotted any so far. Ideally I?d like to blag four or five metres of fibre and install it prior to them fitting the ONT, which should make their life easier. As far as service providers go, Zen have been excellent. 100% reliability since I switched to them several years ago. Not a single outage nor any need to restart the router. Tech support is UK based ( with northern accents ) and they answer emails too. They are not the cheapest, but they have been voted the best provider for eight years running by Which. I?ve had no hassle whatsoever, either technically, or with payments and invoices. The router they supply is excellent too, much better WiFi coverage than the BT one and it has useful additional features, such as allowing you to plug in two USB sticks for music streaming and network storage. Alan > On 4 Apr 2023, at 22:38, Peter Fox via Tech1 wrote: > > ?Open Reach have been busy festooning our telegraph poles with fibre break-out boxes. I haven't noticed anyone changing overhead cables yet (for fttp) but as BT are planning to ditch copper everywhere by 2024 (allegedly) I guess its going to happen to all of us before too long. > And maybe HS2 will reach Euston before it sinks beneath the waves > > Peter Fox From chris at chriswoolf.co.uk Wed Apr 5 04:28:07 2023 From: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk (Chris Woolf) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 10:28:07 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <24245bf2-c241-aebc-8e72-8e3215c572fd@chriswoolf.co.uk> On 04/04/2023 22:37, Peter Fox via Tech1 wrote: > ... as BT are planning to ditch copper everywhere by 2024 (allegedly) . My exchange feed is several km of copper that comes direct from the exchange - no cabinets. The line feeds about five properties and the link to me traverses a stream and a field underground (not ducted), across land owned by a large farming estate. They have a land agent who demands enormous fees for wayleaves and won't allow BT to go digging. It costs them the earth to keep repairing and replacing multicore that suffers endless tree-rubs and squirrel damage, so it might be economically wise for them, but... it is going to be very interesting to see how Open Reach manage to "fiberise" me. Chris Woolf From peter.neill at icloud.com Wed Apr 5 04:36:23 2023 From: peter.neill at icloud.com (Peter Neill) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 10:36:23 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: <24245bf2-c241-aebc-8e72-8e3215c572fd@chriswoolf.co.uk> References: <24245bf2-c241-aebc-8e72-8e3215c572fd@chriswoolf.co.uk> Message-ID: <9B06BB8D-47D0-4F4D-A151-53DD3F930A15@icloud.com> We have BT fibre to cabinet which is Agee hundred yards away. I?ve had no problems at all with it - so haven?t really had any experience of customer service. County Broadband had installed fibre in the village and there?s a connection box just outside our front gate. But to connect to the house would involve digging up the front garden so we?re staying with BT for the time being. Sent from my iPhone. Apologies for typos and autocorruptions. > On 5 Apr 2023, at 10:28, Chris Woolf via Tech1 wrote: > > ? >> On 04/04/2023 22:37, Peter Fox via Tech1 wrote: >> ... as BT are planning to ditch copper everywhere by 2024 (allegedly) . > > My exchange feed is several km of copper that comes direct from the exchange - no cabinets. The line feeds about five properties and the link to me traverses a stream and a field underground (not ducted), across land owned by a large farming estate. They have a land agent who demands enormous fees for wayleaves and won't allow BT to go digging. > > It costs them the earth to keep repairing and replacing multicore that suffers endless tree-rubs and squirrel damage, so it might be economically wise for them, but... it is going to be very interesting to see how Open Reach manage to "fiberise" me. > > > Chris Woolf > > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From plowmandave44 at gmail.com Wed Apr 5 04:46:28 2023 From: plowmandave44 at gmail.com (Dave Plowman) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 10:46:28 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: <9B06BB8D-47D0-4F4D-A151-53DD3F930A15@icloud.com> References: <24245bf2-c241-aebc-8e72-8e3215c572fd@chriswoolf.co.uk> <9B06BB8D-47D0-4F4D-A151-53DD3F930A15@icloud.com> Message-ID: When I hear people say how good customer service is with X I'd rather not have to find out. My heavy use here, I'd guess, is catch-up etc for TV. And that is pretty reliable. So no need to pay for a faster connection. On 05/04/2023 10:36, Peter Neill via Tech1 wrote: > We have BT fibre to cabinet which is Agee hundred yards away. I?ve had no problems at all with it - so haven?t really had any experience of customer service. > County Broadband had installed fibre in the village and there?s a connection box just outside our front gate. But to connect to the house would involve digging up the front garden so we?re staying with BT for the time being. > > Sent from my iPhone. Apologies for typos and autocorruptions. > >> On 5 Apr 2023, at 10:28, Chris Woolf via Tech1 wrote: >> >> ? >>> On 04/04/2023 22:37, Peter Fox via Tech1 wrote: >>> ... as BT are planning to ditch copper everywhere by 2024 (allegedly) . >> >> My exchange feed is several km of copper that comes direct from the exchange - no cabinets. The line feeds about five properties and the link to me traverses a stream and a field underground (not ducted), across land owned by a large farming estate. They have a land agent who demands enormous fees for wayleaves and won't allow BT to go digging. >> >> It costs them the earth to keep repairing and replacing multicore that suffers endless tree-rubs and squirrel damage, so it might be economically wise for them, but... it is going to be very interesting to see how Open Reach manage to "fiberise" me. >> >> >> Chris Woolf >> >> >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > -- Dave Plowman London, SW From alanaudio at me.com Wed Apr 5 05:07:57 2023 From: alanaudio at me.com (Alan Taylor) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 11:07:57 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: <9B06BB8D-47D0-4F4D-A151-53DD3F930A15@icloud.com> References: <9B06BB8D-47D0-4F4D-A151-53DD3F930A15@icloud.com> Message-ID: If a utility company needs to run any cable through your garden, be sure to keep an eye on what they are actually doing. At my previous house, in the days of fax machines and dial-up modems, I got a second telephone line installed. It seemed like a good idea to get it from NTL as at the time they were offering a good deal and from a reliability point of view it made sense to have the two lines supplied and operated by entirely separate companies. It turned out that they ran a thin, completely unprotected cable along the front edge of the flower border, barely 10cm below ground level. At one point it needed to go round some tree roots, so the cable at that point was routed to the back of the border and simply laid on the surface. When you look at the line of the above ground cable and the junction box on the house wall, you would assume that the cable ran along the back of the flower border. Not surprisingly during the next spring, my wife dug over the flower border and chopped through the cable. It was a hell of a job to get NTL to sort it because they insisted that it was caused by our negligence. After involving higher management in the dispute, they agreed to replace the cable and while neither of us were at home, simply ran a duplicate cable along the same route. After a protracted argument, they eventually agreed to re-route the cable to an area where it wouldn?t be disturbed by routine cultivation, to bury it deeper and also agreed to house it in a sheath. They did re-route where I requested. The protective sheath wasn?t the flexible conduit I imagined, but was a merely strip of PVC warning tape laid on top and it was only about 150mm below ground instead of deeper than a spade depth, as agreed. In the end it proved to be an unreliable service. Once broadband became available, I decided to stop using that line and then a different saga began. Trying to cancel a contract with NTL, even though it was long after the minimum contract period. Alan > On 5 Apr 2023, at 10:37, Peter Neill via Tech1 wrote: > . But to connect to the house would involve digging up the front garden so we?re staying with BT for the time being. > > Sent from my iPhone. Apologies for typos and autocorruptions. From chris at chriswoolf.co.uk Wed Apr 5 05:27:43 2023 From: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk (Chris Woolf) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 11:27:43 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: <9B06BB8D-47D0-4F4D-A151-53DD3F930A15@icloud.com> Message-ID: <1ced8875-0ad5-01c0-b4fe-7976fada8f60@chriswoolf.co.uk> When we refurbished West Killatown a decade ago, we wanted to get rid of overhead cable connections for cosmetic reasons. Open Reach simply delivered a reel of cable and 50m of grey duct to our builders, and got them to trench and install everything. Then OR came and did the final connecting up. So around the property everything is ducted, crosses the lane between traps, and comes up inside the plant rooms. Made a great improvement in reliability. Chris Woolf On 05/04/2023 11:07, Alan Taylor via Tech1 wrote: > If a utility company needs to run any cable through your garden, be sure to keep an eye on what they are actually doing. At my previous house, in the days of fax machines and dial-up modems, I got a second telephone line installed. It seemed like a good idea to get it from NTL as at the time they were offering a good deal and from a reliability point of view it made sense to have the two lines supplied and operated by entirely separate companies. > > It turned out that they ran a thin, completely unprotected cable along the front edge of the flower border, barely 10cm below ground level. At one point it needed to go round some tree roots, so the cable at that point was routed to the back of the border and simply laid on the surface. When you look at the line of the above ground cable and the junction box on the house wall, you would assume that the cable ran along the back of the flower border. > > Not surprisingly during the next spring, my wife dug over the flower border and chopped through the cable. It was a hell of a job to get NTL to sort it because they insisted that it was caused by our negligence. After involving higher management in the dispute, they agreed to replace the cable and while neither of us were at home, simply ran a duplicate cable along the same route. > After a protracted argument, they eventually agreed to re-route the cable to an area where it wouldn?t be disturbed by routine cultivation, to bury it deeper and also agreed to house it in a sheath. They did re-route where I requested. The protective sheath wasn?t the flexible conduit I imagined, but was a merely strip of PVC warning tape laid on top and it was only about 150mm below ground instead of deeper than a spade depth, as agreed. > > In the end it proved to be an unreliable service. Once broadband became available, I decided to stop using that line and then a different saga began. Trying to cancel a contract with NTL, even though it was long after the minimum contract period. > > Alan > > > >> On 5 Apr 2023, at 10:37, Peter Neill via Tech1 wrote: >> . But to connect to the house would involve digging up the front garden so we?re staying with BT for the time being. >> >> Sent from my iPhone. Apologies for typos and autocorruptions. From david.jasma at sky.com Wed Apr 5 05:45:58 2023 From: david.jasma at sky.com (Dave Buckley) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 11:45:58 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: <9B06BB8D-47D0-4F4D-A151-53DD3F930A15@icloud.com> References: <24245bf2-c241-aebc-8e72-8e3215c572fd@chriswoolf.co.uk> <9B06BB8D-47D0-4F4D-A151-53DD3F930A15@icloud.com> Message-ID: <0dfa92ea-770e-6d20-6dc2-e504f6f464dc@sky.com> TalkTalk - ugh, I joined them after beeb.net closed down, and all was reasonably well for a while. However, every weekday, between 4pm - 5pm, the internet slowed down, so much so, that I did a series of speed tests over a few days and sent the results to TalkTalk, (and phoned them). All I got back was - 'we'll send an engineer to check your line'. Fine, as long as he comes between four and five in the afternoon! While out shopping, we passed a Sky stand and stopped for a chat. The result was we changed over to them, including the phone. When Sky fibre came along, I changed to that and we were actually put on a day early. The only problem was that there was a cap per month of 25Gb and if you got near it, an email arrived warning me, that, if I went over three months in a row, I would be changed to unlimited at a higher price. (which did happen) As with most ISP Sky has changed its packages, and I'm now on the 80Megs version which suits me fine. Unlike some members, I'm about 200 yards from the exchange and the Openreach cabinet is immediately outside the exchange, so I haven't had any line problems. As for the changeover to voice over internet, I have wired the telephone lines inside my property and have two wall phones and a DEC master unit + two extensions. Through another email group, I have been in touch with a BT engineer who is actively involved with the change-over,. He sent me a very useful diagram (attached) which shows how to keep 'directly' connected handsets working after changeover. When the time comes, I am proposing to buy a unit plus an uninterruptible power supply to keep the router and D to A box powered. I realise that the DEC won't work, but at least I will have a couple of phones that still work. The main problem with going over to VOI has already been stated - no power, no phone. But having seen the size of the phones, plus having to have a mains socket nearby, means that they take up quite a space. We couldn't have one in the bedroom, for instance, as the side tables are too small and the four mains sockets are all in use as well! Dave Buckley -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: DVdelivery1.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 127757 bytes Desc: not available URL: From stevewlowry at hotmail.com Wed Apr 5 08:33:35 2023 From: stevewlowry at hotmail.com (Steve Lowry) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 13:33:35 +0000 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: <009501d96748$1a003df0$4e00b9d0$@pgtmedia.co.uk> References: <009501d96748$1a003df0$4e00b9d0$@pgtmedia.co.uk> Message-ID: Hi, Fibre to the Premises (FTP) ? Do I have to!? I have Broadband provided to my home via Fibre to the cabinet (FTC) which, with good speeds (of 48.3Mbps Download and 9.05Mbps Upload), seems more than adequate for all my broadband needs. Maybe, if I had a few teenagers scattered about my home all streaming HD TV simultaneously, I would be craving more speed, but I am not. It is very reliable as-is, thanks. I?m sure that many others, like me, don?t need the much greater speeds that Fibre to the Premises (FTP) can offer? But yes, a Fibre to the Premises (FTP) capability is being installed in many streets across the UK ready for the aim to have everyone moved to FTP by end-of-2015 ? BUT I really don?t want it? yet. Why? Please, please tell me if I have any of this wrong! 1. As I?ve already said, my current Broadband speeds - provided by my favoured ISP (Plusnet who I like as a provider very much (even if they are now owned by BT)) are more than adequate. 2. If I wanted to keep my existing landline phone number when moved to a FTP provision of a pseudo-landline phone, only BT of all the ISPs seem to promise that the move from an analog ?copper?, power-cut-proofed landline, to an SIP/ VOIP solution will maintain my existing Landline number. (Yes, there are some other broadband providers who offer to ?do their best? to keep your landline number when they move you to an SIP/ VOIP solution - Vodafone will ?do its best? to keep your old landline number but quite a few customers moving to a Vodafone FTP solution have had their landline number irretrievably lost by Vodafone in this move; those unhappy customers are then pointed to the small print in the contract which states there is no guarantee they won?t loose their old number in the move to FTP) 3. My BT Master socket in my home is not on an external wall; it was installed in a convenient wall for my needs, several internal walls away from the outside BT junction point, run in when the house was being built ? There is no easy way fibre could be brought to that same master socket position in my home. Therefore, a new master socket would be needed in my home on a wall that could allow Openreach to connect via a quite different external wall ? Would they install the new run required to get the fibre across my front garden to the new wall position well, or just a few inches below my roses? Or would they insist on running the fibre to the position of their existing external wall point which is a totally impractical position for internal connection to anything? Oh dear. 4. My ISP, Plusnet, if I were to ask to be moved to FTP with them would ditch my copper landline (of course) BUT they do not provide any SIP/ VOIP solution / equivalent for any kind of Landline-like facility. If I objected to the loss of any ?landline, with or without an existing landline number even via SIP/ VOIP?, they would just help me to sign-up to BT Broadband instead and discard me as their customer, giving me to BT. That?s their current policy! (Now, I know some might be wondering why I want to keep my existing Landline number? I have had it for 30+years, everyone knows it ? from friends in USA who only fly into Blighty once a decade to friends and businesses who have the number to contact me on, and sometimes to prove it is me talking with them) 5. The BT ?Voice? implementation of SIP/ VOIP is propriety to them only. You MUST use their provided router for their BT Voice system to work, no other than the BT Modem will work with BT Voice. Anyone who has their own Wireless router or Wi-Fi-Mesh system to provide better Wi-Fi coverage around the home (better than the bog-standard ISP-provided Wireless router) would find the continued use of that better kit practically impossible because of how the ?necessary? BT Modem (for the Propriety BT Voice system to work) does not allow use of a wireless router alongside it. 6. I have extensions for my landline around the house; I have phones scattered around the home for my convenience; some are just DECT phones but others are wired into the BT master socket via wired extension sockets. Should the power fail, I can pick up a phone on such a wired extension (in the bedroom, say) and be able to call out, still. How many phones do you get with the standard BT Voice ?solution?? One. 7. The separate 50+ companies who are all beavering away installing Fibre into the UK streets ? How many of those 50+ companies are going to survive financially long-term, and when a number may fail because they have big upfront costs to still be funded long before any return from FTP adoptions comes in, who is going to adopt the customers (+ the particular fibre kit of the failed companies & their broadband provision), customers who were relying on this now-bankrupted company for their broadband? 8. Funnily enough, with a couple of UPSs already in my home, the loss of a power-cut- proofed phone is one of my least concerns about being moved to FTP, like it or not, by 2016! Am I being silly, a luddite, and should I have abandoned a landline that everyone knows how to contact me via, and gone mobile only? Should I embrace this offer for an increased broadband speed that I don?t need despite all the apparent downsides of FTP? 9. We all enjoy choice ? I chose Plusnet as my Broadband provider ? Each to their own, for cost, regional availability, decent customer service and/or other features. Yet this national FTP project seems to be making this freedom of choice more difficult unless you are willing to lose features that that your current broadband provider offers (e.g., In my case, the free option of being able to choose a Fixed-IP address for my incoming broadband with Plusnet ? (BT do not allow this unless you have a Business package with them)). I?m hoping that, as a happy reliable FTC user and with the copper link between that cabinet fibre and my home only 30 years old, I will be one of the last to be forced over to FTP and by then (2016?) maybe the negatives I have listed above will have been addressed? Ha! Thanks for your time, and any positive corrections to my thinking! Steve (Lowry) -----Original Message----- From: Tech1 On Behalf Of paul--- via Tech1 Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2023 11:52 PM To: 'Peter Fox' ; 'Nick Ware' Cc: Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk; 'Hugh Snape' Subject: Re: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare Hi Pete, I believe BT Open Reach target for all SIP / VOIP phones has slipped to December 2025 already, although they are pressing ahead with it as are Virgin Media. I get my services from Virgin and had a line issue with my Land Line a couple of weeks ago. The engineer told me they were rolling the new SIP/ VOIP phones area by area and my area was due in a few months' time. As a result, I had my 'upgrade' there and then as it would save me a visit in a few months and he was not re run the cable just for a few weeks. About 10mins and all was sorted on the new system. Only downside is your home power goes off so does your phone (As its not powered from the exchange now - no reduction in price even though they are no longer powering it!) If you ask for a back up they will provide a battery backed phone which uses a SIM if the line goes. No charge , but you have to ask. Your own mobile is probably a better back up. I did ask for there back up, but looking at the size, put it back in its box and away. I suspect if you have a Burglar alarm/ panic alarm or medical emergency alarm on your current phone, you could be in to a world of pain to swap over. Paul Paul Thackray PGT Media Consulting Ltd. +44 7802 243979 Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Web; https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pgtmedia.co.uk%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=lLn7UZRT0ki43RUaO2TYOsiVkgx4H7955qkaICOvvYI%3D&reserved=0 Linkedin; https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fuk.linkedin.com%2Fpub%2Fpaul-thackray%2F19%2F379%2F746&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=Q4cE0yBS4cm%2BFGZ43Pwbw%2BWoObtBUsZ1xSSXvILkkc0%3D&reserved=0 IMDB; https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.imdb.com%2Fname%2Fnm1488554%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=uxG2vfbTvAUv2BAnsx4FMa4hdxAw1zBVMzViHEYuqsU%3D&reserved=0 -----Original Message----- From: Tech1 > On Behalf Of Peter Fox via Tech1 Sent: 04 April 2023 22:38 To: Nick Ware > Cc: Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk; Hugh Snape > Subject: Re: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare Open Reach have been busy festooning our telegraph poles with fibre break-out boxes. I haven't noticed anyone changing overhead cables yet (for fttp) but as BT are planning to ditch copper everywhere by 2024 (allegedly) I guess its going to happen to all of us before too long. And maybe HS2 will reach Euston before it sinks beneath the waves Peter Fox On 4 Apr 2023, at 22:22, Nick Ware via Tech1 > wrote: ?The trouble with TalkTalk is that the one thing you can?t do is TalkTo them! N. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad > On 4 Apr 2023, at 15:05, Hugh Snape > wrote: > > ?As a disgruntled, long term, TalkTalk customer I would consider Box but unfortunately its service isn?t available in South Devon. > > NB, our speeds with TalkTalk are quite good 69.8 down, 13.5 up, but a bit variable, the problems arrive if there?s a fault when TT is an absolute pain to deal with . . . > > Hugh Snape > >> On 4 Apr 2023, at 14:48, Nick Ware via Tech1 > wrote: >> >> Ours was corroded old copper all the way. At best 16 Mb/sec down and 2 up, and often nothing at all, and was sold as ?faster fibre? for ?34 per month. With Box I could have 1Gb/sec up and down for that amount, but don?t have a need for it. >> Cheers, >> Nick. >> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >> >>>> On 4 Apr 2023, at 13:56, Dave Plowman via Tech1 > wrote: >>> >>> ?My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. >>> >>>> On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >>>> I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. >>>> Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. >>>> And then the fun started! >>>> We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. >>>> Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. >>>> ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. >>>> Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. >>>> On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. >>>> Cheers, >>>> N. >>>> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >>> >>> -- >>> Dave Plowman >>> London, SW >>> >>> -- >>> Tech1 mailing list >>> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftech-ops.co.uk%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftech1_tech-ops.co.uk&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=OtotjEBDy0QMCvxQIjEHaGmcZ5Wqxudo6LHMRdr0QdY%3D&reserved=0 >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftech-ops.co.uk%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftech1_tech-ops.co.uk&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=OtotjEBDy0QMCvxQIjEHaGmcZ5Wqxudo6LHMRdr0QdY%3D&reserved=0 > -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftech-ops.co.uk%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftech1_tech-ops.co.uk&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=OtotjEBDy0QMCvxQIjEHaGmcZ5Wqxudo6LHMRdr0QdY%3D&reserved=0 -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftech-ops.co.uk%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftech1_tech-ops.co.uk&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=OtotjEBDy0QMCvxQIjEHaGmcZ5Wqxudo6LHMRdr0QdY%3D&reserved=0 -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftech-ops.co.uk%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftech1_tech-ops.co.uk&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=OtotjEBDy0QMCvxQIjEHaGmcZ5Wqxudo6LHMRdr0QdY%3D&reserved=0 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hughsnape at talktalk.net Wed Apr 5 08:34:37 2023 From: hughsnape at talktalk.net (Hugh Snape) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 14:34:37 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: <1ced8875-0ad5-01c0-b4fe-7976fada8f60@chriswoolf.co.uk> References: <9B06BB8D-47D0-4F4D-A151-53DD3F930A15@icloud.com> <1ced8875-0ad5-01c0-b4fe-7976fada8f60@chriswoolf.co.uk> Message-ID: <897BE736-558E-4013-B54C-7EEC91013206@talktalk.net> The overhead copper reaches our house comes by a rather convoluted route, down the side of our garden to a pole in the corner, then across the bottom of two neighbours gardens to another pole by the road, and then back up the hill to roughly the elevation it started at and thence underground to a cabinet which is at the bottom of the same hill again; a real zig zag route. About 15 years ago a team from Fujitsu (working on BT?s behalf) came and inspected the pole in the corner of our garden, condemned it and said it would be replaced. Nothing happened. 5 years later someone from OpenReach came and stuck a D (do not climb) notice on the pole and said it would be replaced. Since then we?ve had numerous visits from OpenReach, and their subcontractors, all with the same story and intention. At one point, when the cable was damaged, a Scottish scaffolding team came and built a (very expensive I understand) tower next to the pole so an OpenReach engineer could repair the cable without risk to himself. Further visits and inspections have happened twice this year whilst the fibre installation frenzy was going on elsewhere in the town. I had a long chat with a nice chap who came to have a look about a month ago. He said the pole was actually reasonably sound and that his company might come back in the summer but he?d seen far worse examples, poles at all sorts of odd angles, which had not been condemned. I presume the pole?s been here since a ?phone line was first put in in the 1940?s as it has no date carved in it and retains the old cross bars at the top with porcelain pots for uninsulated wires. It it ever is replaced the job will be very awkward as there?s no access for machinery and the pole sits right next to a brick manhole, probably of the same vintage. I?d like to see the pole replaced because the crossbars make a handy place for Pigeons to perch whilst they contemplate raiding our vegetable beds. However, with regard to its fragility or not, I regularly rest my ladder against it when cutting the hedge and can confirm it?s as steady as a rock . . . Hugh > On 5 Apr 2023, at 11:27, Chris Woolf via Tech1 wrote: > > When we refurbished West Killatown a decade ago, we wanted to get rid of overhead cable connections for cosmetic reasons. Open Reach simply delivered a reel of cable and 50m of grey duct to our builders, and got them to trench and install everything. Then OR came and did the final connecting up. So around the property everything is ducted, crosses the lane between traps, and comes up inside the plant rooms. Made a great improvement in reliability. > > Chris Woolf > > > On 05/04/2023 11:07, Alan Taylor via Tech1 wrote: >> If a utility company needs to run any cable through your garden, be sure to keep an eye on what they are actually doing. At my previous house, in the days of fax machines and dial-up modems, I got a second telephone line installed. It seemed like a good idea to get it from NTL as at the time they were offering a good deal and from a reliability point of view it made sense to have the two lines supplied and operated by entirely separate companies. >> >> It turned out that they ran a thin, completely unprotected cable along the front edge of the flower border, barely 10cm below ground level. At one point it needed to go round some tree roots, so the cable at that point was routed to the back of the border and simply laid on the surface. When you look at the line of the above ground cable and the junction box on the house wall, you would assume that the cable ran along the back of the flower border. >> >> Not surprisingly during the next spring, my wife dug over the flower border and chopped through the cable. It was a hell of a job to get NTL to sort it because they insisted that it was caused by our negligence. After involving higher management in the dispute, they agreed to replace the cable and while neither of us were at home, simply ran a duplicate cable along the same route. >> After a protracted argument, they eventually agreed to re-route the cable to an area where it wouldn?t be disturbed by routine cultivation, to bury it deeper and also agreed to house it in a sheath. They did re-route where I requested. The protective sheath wasn?t the flexible conduit I imagined, but was a merely strip of PVC warning tape laid on top and it was only about 150mm below ground instead of deeper than a spade depth, as agreed. >> >> In the end it proved to be an unreliable service. Once broadband became available, I decided to stop using that line and then a different saga began. Trying to cancel a contract with NTL, even though it was long after the minimum contract period. >> >> Alan >> >> >> >>> On 5 Apr 2023, at 10:37, Peter Neill via Tech1 wrote: >>> . But to connect to the house would involve digging up the front garden so we?re staying with BT for the time being. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone. Apologies for typos and autocorruptions. > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From plowmandave44 at gmail.com Wed Apr 5 08:57:52 2023 From: plowmandave44 at gmail.com (Dave Plowman) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 14:57:52 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Life Lines R4 Message-ID: A new series just started on R4 today. Basically, a day in the life of a 999 operator, and everything as heard from her end. Phone calls in and RT to the emergency services. Not a drama that would work on TV, but brilliant radio. Worth the licence fee just for this sort of thing. -- Dave Plowman London, SW From alanaudio at me.com Wed Apr 5 10:00:56 2023 From: alanaudio at me.com (Alan Taylor) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 16:00:56 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4DABEFCA-2B5C-4C7D-87EE-2EA86F327F99@me.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Waresound at msn.com Wed Apr 5 10:06:56 2023 From: Waresound at msn.com (Nick Ware) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 15:06:56 +0000 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: <009501d96748$1a003df0$4e00b9d0$@pgtmedia.co.uk> Message-ID: A couple of things worth mentioning: We decided that as we both have O2 mobiles with good signal integrity, did we need a landline phone number? We decided not. Secondly, if planning a route under floors, through walls etc., run a plastic pipe that the fibre can be gently pushed through. Avoid sharp corners though. I did that, and when the fibre arrived, getting it to where we wanted the router was a doddle. The fibre is only approx 3mm diameter, and the optical connector is about 2/3 the size of a Cat5 plug. A long time ago, I was in Guildford Cathedral very late one night, trying to get some mic cables through a series of conduits under the stone floor. It was a long run with a lift-off cover every 100ft or so. I was on the point of tears with frustration at not being able to get the cables through, when I suddenly espied a Henry Hoover smiling at me in a corner right in front of me. I had a roll of lacing cord with me, and found a cork from a bottle of ?Old Red Altar Wine? in a nearby waste bin. I?m not sure if the cork gets Consecrated along with the wine, but for once in my life I did get a sensation of Divine Intervention coming into play! Once the cord was sucked through, the rest was easy. A technique that I?ve used many times since that Eureka moment. Cheers, Nick. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad On 5 Apr 2023, at 14:33, Steve Lowry wrote: ? Hi, Fibre to the Premises (FTP) ? Do I have to!? I have Broadband provided to my home via Fibre to the cabinet (FTC) which, with good speeds (of 48.3Mbps Download and 9.05Mbps Upload), seems more than adequate for all my broadband needs. Maybe, if I had a few teenagers scattered about my home all streaming HD TV simultaneously, I would be craving more speed, but I am not. It is very reliable as-is, thanks. I?m sure that many others, like me, don?t need the much greater speeds that Fibre to the Premises (FTP) can offer? But yes, a Fibre to the Premises (FTP) capability is being installed in many streets across the UK ready for the aim to have everyone moved to FTP by end-of-2015 ? BUT I really don?t want it? yet. Why? Please, please tell me if I have any of this wrong! 1. As I?ve already said, my current Broadband speeds - provided by my favoured ISP (Plusnet who I like as a provider very much (even if they are now owned by BT)) are more than adequate. 2. If I wanted to keep my existing landline phone number when moved to a FTP provision of a pseudo-landline phone, only BT of all the ISPs seem to promise that the move from an analog ?copper?, power-cut-proofed landline, to an SIP/ VOIP solution will maintain my existing Landline number. (Yes, there are some other broadband providers who offer to ?do their best? to keep your landline number when they move you to an SIP/ VOIP solution - Vodafone will ?do its best? to keep your old landline number but quite a few customers moving to a Vodafone FTP solution have had their landline number irretrievably lost by Vodafone in this move; those unhappy customers are then pointed to the small print in the contract which states there is no guarantee they won?t loose their old number in the move to FTP) 3. My BT Master socket in my home is not on an external wall; it was installed in a convenient wall for my needs, several internal walls away from the outside BT junction point, run in when the house was being built ? There is no easy way fibre could be brought to that same master socket position in my home. Therefore, a new master socket would be needed in my home on a wall that could allow Openreach to connect via a quite different external wall ? Would they install the new run required to get the fibre across my front garden to the new wall position well, or just a few inches below my roses? Or would they insist on running the fibre to the position of their existing external wall point which is a totally impractical position for internal connection to anything? Oh dear. 4. My ISP, Plusnet, if I were to ask to be moved to FTP with them would ditch my copper landline (of course) BUT they do not provide any SIP/ VOIP solution / equivalent for any kind of Landline-like facility. If I objected to the loss of any ?landline, with or without an existing landline number even via SIP/ VOIP?, they would just help me to sign-up to BT Broadband instead and discard me as their customer, giving me to BT. That?s their current policy! (Now, I know some might be wondering why I want to keep my existing Landline number? I have had it for 30+years, everyone knows it ? from friends in USA who only fly into Blighty once a decade to friends and businesses who have the number to contact me on, and sometimes to prove it is me talking with them) 5. The BT ?Voice? implementation of SIP/ VOIP is propriety to them only. You MUST use their provided router for their BT Voice system to work, no other than the BT Modem will work with BT Voice. Anyone who has their own Wireless router or Wi-Fi-Mesh system to provide better Wi-Fi coverage around the home (better than the bog-standard ISP-provided Wireless router) would find the continued use of that better kit practically impossible because of how the ?necessary? BT Modem (for the Propriety BT Voice system to work) does not allow use of a wireless router alongside it. 6. I have extensions for my landline around the house; I have phones scattered around the home for my convenience; some are just DECT phones but others are wired into the BT master socket via wired extension sockets. Should the power fail, I can pick up a phone on such a wired extension (in the bedroom, say) and be able to call out, still. How many phones do you get with the standard BT Voice ?solution?? One. 7. The separate 50+ companies who are all beavering away installing Fibre into the UK streets ? How many of those 50+ companies are going to survive financially long-term, and when a number may fail because they have big upfront costs to still be funded long before any return from FTP adoptions comes in, who is going to adopt the customers (+ the particular fibre kit of the failed companies & their broadband provision), customers who were relying on this now-bankrupted company for their broadband? 8. Funnily enough, with a couple of UPSs already in my home, the loss of a power-cut- proofed phone is one of my least concerns about being moved to FTP, like it or not, by 2016! Am I being silly, a luddite, and should I have abandoned a landline that everyone knows how to contact me via, and gone mobile only? Should I embrace this offer for an increased broadband speed that I don?t need despite all the apparent downsides of FTP? 9. We all enjoy choice ? I chose Plusnet as my Broadband provider ? Each to their own, for cost, regional availability, decent customer service and/or other features. Yet this national FTP project seems to be making this freedom of choice more difficult unless you are willing to lose features that that your current broadband provider offers (e.g., In my case, the free option of being able to choose a Fixed-IP address for my incoming broadband with Plusnet ? (BT do not allow this unless you have a Business package with them)). I?m hoping that, as a happy reliable FTC user and with the copper link between that cabinet fibre and my home only 30 years old, I will be one of the last to be forced over to FTP and by then (2016?) maybe the negatives I have listed above will have been addressed? Ha! Thanks for your time, and any positive corrections to my thinking! Steve (Lowry) -----Original Message----- From: Tech1 On Behalf Of paul--- via Tech1 Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2023 11:52 PM To: 'Peter Fox' ; 'Nick Ware' Cc: Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk; 'Hugh Snape' Subject: Re: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare Hi Pete, I believe BT Open Reach target for all SIP / VOIP phones has slipped to December 2025 already, although they are pressing ahead with it as are Virgin Media. I get my services from Virgin and had a line issue with my Land Line a couple of weeks ago. The engineer told me they were rolling the new SIP/ VOIP phones area by area and my area was due in a few months' time. As a result, I had my 'upgrade' there and then as it would save me a visit in a few months and he was not re run the cable just for a few weeks. About 10mins and all was sorted on the new system. Only downside is your home power goes off so does your phone (As its not powered from the exchange now - no reduction in price even though they are no longer powering it!) If you ask for a back up they will provide a battery backed phone which uses a SIM if the line goes. No charge , but you have to ask. Your own mobile is probably a better back up. I did ask for there back up, but looking at the size, put it back in its box and away. I suspect if you have a Burglar alarm/ panic alarm or medical emergency alarm on your current phone, you could be in to a world of pain to swap over. Paul Paul Thackray PGT Media Consulting Ltd. +44 7802 243979 Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Web; https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pgtmedia.co.uk%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=lLn7UZRT0ki43RUaO2TYOsiVkgx4H7955qkaICOvvYI%3D&reserved=0 Linkedin; https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fuk.linkedin.com%2Fpub%2Fpaul-thackray%2F19%2F379%2F746&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=Q4cE0yBS4cm%2BFGZ43Pwbw%2BWoObtBUsZ1xSSXvILkkc0%3D&reserved=0 IMDB; https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.imdb.com%2Fname%2Fnm1488554%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=uxG2vfbTvAUv2BAnsx4FMa4hdxAw1zBVMzViHEYuqsU%3D&reserved=0 -----Original Message----- From: Tech1 > On Behalf Of Peter Fox via Tech1 Sent: 04 April 2023 22:38 To: Nick Ware > Cc: Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk; Hugh Snape > Subject: Re: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare Open Reach have been busy festooning our telegraph poles with fibre break-out boxes. I haven't noticed anyone changing overhead cables yet (for fttp) but as BT are planning to ditch copper everywhere by 2024 (allegedly) I guess its going to happen to all of us before too long. And maybe HS2 will reach Euston before it sinks beneath the waves Peter Fox On 4 Apr 2023, at 22:22, Nick Ware via Tech1 > wrote: ?The trouble with TalkTalk is that the one thing you can?t do is TalkTo them! N. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad > On 4 Apr 2023, at 15:05, Hugh Snape > wrote: > > ?As a disgruntled, long term, TalkTalk customer I would consider Box but unfortunately its service isn?t available in South Devon. > > NB, our speeds with TalkTalk are quite good 69.8 down, 13.5 up, but a bit variable, the problems arrive if there?s a fault when TT is an absolute pain to deal with . . . > > Hugh Snape > >> On 4 Apr 2023, at 14:48, Nick Ware via Tech1 > wrote: >> >> Ours was corroded old copper all the way. At best 16 Mb/sec down and 2 up, and often nothing at all, and was sold as ?faster fibre? for ?34 per month. With Box I could have 1Gb/sec up and down for that amount, but don?t have a need for it. >> Cheers, >> Nick. >> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >> >>>> On 4 Apr 2023, at 13:56, Dave Plowman via Tech1 > wrote: >>> >>> ?My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. >>> >>>> On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: >>>> I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. >>>> Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. >>>> And then the fun started! >>>> We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. >>>> Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. >>>> ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. >>>> Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. >>>> On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. >>>> Cheers, >>>> N. >>>> Nick Ware - sent from my iPad >>> >>> -- >>> Dave Plowman >>> London, SW >>> >>> -- >>> Tech1 mailing list >>> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftech-ops.co.uk%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftech1_tech-ops.co.uk&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=OtotjEBDy0QMCvxQIjEHaGmcZ5Wqxudo6LHMRdr0QdY%3D&reserved=0 >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftech-ops.co.uk%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftech1_tech-ops.co.uk&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=OtotjEBDy0QMCvxQIjEHaGmcZ5Wqxudo6LHMRdr0QdY%3D&reserved=0 > -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftech-ops.co.uk%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftech1_tech-ops.co.uk&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=OtotjEBDy0QMCvxQIjEHaGmcZ5Wqxudo6LHMRdr0QdY%3D&reserved=0 -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftech-ops.co.uk%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftech1_tech-ops.co.uk&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=OtotjEBDy0QMCvxQIjEHaGmcZ5Wqxudo6LHMRdr0QdY%3D&reserved=0 -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftech-ops.co.uk%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftech1_tech-ops.co.uk&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=OtotjEBDy0QMCvxQIjEHaGmcZ5Wqxudo6LHMRdr0QdY%3D&reserved=0 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chris at chriswoolf.co.uk Wed Apr 5 10:30:29 2023 From: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk (Chris Woolf) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 16:30:29 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: <4DABEFCA-2B5C-4C7D-87EE-2EA86F327F99@me.com> References: <4DABEFCA-2B5C-4C7D-87EE-2EA86F327F99@me.com> Message-ID: On 05/04/2023 16:00, Alan Taylor via Tech1 wrote: > .... > > I wouldn?t be too worried about a small cable company installing fibre > to your house and then going bust. ?They won?t derig the fibre and > take it away when they cease trading. ?Another company will take over > from them and although you might not like that particular company, it > should all keep working.. Ah, but the new company has you by the goolies at that point. "Yes, sir, we can keep the fibre running, but you will have to use us as your new ISP, and here are our T & Cs." If you don't like what they are providing, or the new price, you can, of course, say no thank you.... leaving you with nothing, since the old copper has gone. An ubiquitous nationalised network is the only "safe" solution. About 15 years ago I was involved with a business that was about to start up on a new "science" estate in the country. The entire estate was miles from a BT connection but invested in a grand scale satellite multi-access broadband for everyone. Just as my friends were about to sign a lease the satellite company decided it wasn't a money-spinner, and pulled the plug. All the businesses on the estate had to hurriedly move, and the estate developers went scat. Chris Woolf From dave.mdv at btinternet.com Wed Apr 5 10:44:38 2023 From: dave.mdv at btinternet.com (dave.mdv) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 16:44:38 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Eureka! Message-ID: <67aad724-34b8-7166-155f-6469cbb6a8c8@btinternet.com> I was once told that the BBC OB riggers used a ferret to take a cord across from the Victoria Monument, in front of Buck House, to Canada Gate where all our cables ended up, and allow them to pull a rope through and then then the actual broadcast cables! Cheers, Dave From paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Wed Apr 5 10:59:23 2023 From: paul at pgtmedia.co.uk (paul at pgtmedia.co.uk) Date: Wed, 05 Apr 2023 16:59:23 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: <4DABEFCA-2B5C-4C7D-87EE-2EA86F327F99@me.com> Message-ID: <2fj5ljp3bpo36d2fnh2138uu.1680710363043@pgtmedia.co.uk> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alanaudio at me.com Wed Apr 5 11:31:34 2023 From: alanaudio at me.com (Alan Taylor) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 17:31:34 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: <2fj5ljp3bpo36d2fnh2138uu.1680710363043@pgtmedia.co.uk> References: <2fj5ljp3bpo36d2fnh2138uu.1680710363043@pgtmedia.co.uk> Message-ID: 4G and 5G are already here and have been for some time. I only referred to 3G as it?s arrival marked the point when we got a reliable signal everywhere in the house, which in turn meant that we could reduce our dependency on the landline. Alan > On 5 Apr 2023, at 16:59, paul at pgtmedia.co.uk wrote: > Hi Alan, > Hopefully you will get 4 or 5 G in your area as all 4 of the real mobile providers are planning to close down 3G over the next few years, which will also turn most smart meters dumb! >> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From stevewlowry at hotmail.com Wed Apr 5 11:47:24 2023 From: stevewlowry at hotmail.com (Steve Lowry) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 16:47:24 +0000 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: <009501d96748$1a003df0$4e00b9d0$@pgtmedia.co.uk> Message-ID: Nick and Alan, Thanks very much for your thoughts on the subject ? much appreciated. Although I still feel that all ISPs should all offer some kind of VOIP option for customers when they move to FTP, I shall attempt to wean myself off landline-dependence! As with your landline, Alan, many of the calls to my landline number are only nuisance calls ? I had assumed that the only reason that my mobile received much fewer nuisance calls in comparison was because I hadn?t shared that mobile number so freely. If I do feel confident enough to ditch my landline number when I must move to FTP, the move to FTP would be far less restricting - For which ISP I could choose as my broadband provider and, consequently, how much of my exiting in-house Wi-Fi kit / router / configurations etc that I could continue using. I know exactly where I would like the ONT to be fitted and that is on a new wall nowhere near the current BT home-entry point, but it would be near to available mains and (after a room re-arrangement) still work with my re-positioned broadband-dependent bits & pieces. If only the builders of my home had built to that Guildford Cathedral Spec.! Nevertheless, using a Henry to move ?Old Red Altar Wine? corks through conduits is a skill I should also practice. What fun! First, a bottle of wine (non-altar)?.. Everyone was polite enough not to point out that the dates I mentioned in my original email were all a decade out (e.g. 2015, rather than 2025) ? Sorry about that ? All corrected in this version? I think! I bought my parents what they would have called a ?wireless? phone ? It went in the drawer, was never used and never charged ? Too technical! And that from a father who used to be an Engineering Officer in the RAF. Old age and evolving technology ? A scary combination if/when we ever reach that old age? Thanks again for your thoughts, Steve From: Tech1 tech1-bounces at tech-ops.co.uk On Behalf Of Alan Taylor via Tech1 Sent: Wednesday, April 5, 2023 4:01 PM To: tech1 tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk Subject: Re: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare My situation is much simpler. We moved to this house a little over ten years ago. At first the mobile signal was poor, but within a few months a 3G mast was installed nearby and we got reliable reception everywhere indoors, even in the rooms with the thickest stone walls. From that point on, we weaned everybody off using the landline. After a few years, nearly all the calls to our landline were spam marketing calls. I set all of our extension phones to ring silently and had an answerphone message saying ?Due to the number of idiots from call centres making nuisance calls, this number rings silently and is no longer monitored. If you genuinely know us, call our mobiles, otherwise leave a message and we?ll get back to you.? We?ve had a fair few call to the phone, but nobody has left any messages for more than a year. I?m entirely comfortable about dispensing with the landline. I?ll be glad to get rid of the extension phones too. They are all DECT phones and just sit there drinking power - albeit only a modest amount, but it?s rated as 3x 5W for the extensions and 1x 15W for the base station/answerphone. I doubt that it actually uses 30W altogether all the time, but that consumption serves no useful purpose. My reason for abandoning the landline was more to do with eliminating nuisance calls. Janet sometimes works night shifts and she doesn?t appreciate somebody phoning her up while she tries to sleep during the day. A phone ringing somewhere in the house can still wake her up even if the bedroom phone is silent. I have no need for faster data connections, but it looks as though a faster fibre connection will be provided for what is in effect the same price as my existing broadband. I can?t see a downside to getting faster data for about the same price. Although power cuts are commonplace here, losing the landline and fibre during a power cut wouldn?t be much of an issue for us. But I do have an uninterruptible 12V supply which will power my router and will probably power the fibre box too. If I?m able to provide my own back up for it, I certainly will. I wouldn?t be too worried about a small cable company installing fibre to your house and then going bust. They won?t derig the fibre and take it away when they cease trading. Another company will take over from them and although you might not like that particular company, it should all keep working. As far as fibre into the house is concerned, a fibre cable runs from the outside connection to the ONT. The ONT is conceptually similar to your master socket. Everything else is fed from the ONT, most likely either by CAT6 cable or wirelessly. Unlike a master socket, the ONT requires a convenient mains supply too, which can complicate where it might be located. For houses which have had extension telephone cables neatly installed and then decorated over, going over to fibre might well create challenges. That?s another reason why I have weaned everybody off my landline because a few years ago I deduced that it wouldn?t remain in use for much longer. The comms companies all tell us that everything will be hunky-dory, but you only need to think it through for a moment to realise that trying to retain the sort of arrangement you had with extension phones wired to slave sockets is not going to be easy. Furthermore, VOIP phones aren?t necessarily intuitive for some people. My mother had dementia in her later years. I gave her a DECT phone to keep by her bedside for emergencies, but had to replace it with a cabled extension phone because I couldn?t get her to understand that although you just pick up a normal phone and say ?Hello?, with wireless phones, you need to pick it up and press the answer button before you can use it and then press the hang up button afterwards. I tried telling her, showing her, labelling the buttons and leaving notes, but it was never going to happen. I couldn?t imagine getting her to use a VOIP phone. Alan From: Tech1 wrote: ? Hi, Fibre to the Premises (FTP) ? Do I have to!? I have Broadband provided to my home via Fibre to the cabinet (FTC) which, with good speeds (of 48.3Mbps Download and 9.05Mbps Upload), seems more than adequate for all my broadband needs. Maybe, if I had a few teenagers scattered about my home all streaming HD TV simultaneously, I would be craving more speed, but I am not. It is very reliable as-is, thanks. I?m sure that many others, like me, don?t need the much greater speeds that Fibre to the Premises (FTP) can offer? But yes, a Fibre to the Premises (FTP) capability is being installed in many streets across the UK ready for the aim to have everyone moved to FTP by end-of-2025 ? BUT I really don?t want it? yet. Why? Please, please tell me if I have any of this wrong! 1. As I?ve already said, my current Broadband speeds - provided by my favoured ISP (Plusnet who I like as a provider very much (even if they are now owned by BT)) are more than adequate. 2. If I wanted to keep my existing landline phone number when moved to a FTP provision of a pseudo-landline phone, only BT of all the ISPs seem to promise that the move from an analog ?copper?, power-cut-proofed landline, to an SIP/ VOIP solution will maintain my existing Landline number. (Yes, there are some other broadband providers who offer to ?do their best? to keep your landline number when they move you to an SIP/ VOIP solution - Vodafone will ?do its best? to keep your old landline number but quite a few customers moving to a Vodafone FTP solution have had their landline number irretrievably lost by Vodafone in this move; those unhappy customers are then pointed to the small print in the contract which states there is no guarantee they won?t loose their old number in the move to FTP) 3. My BT Master socket in my home is not on an external wall; it was installed in a convenient wall for my needs, several internal walls away from the outside BT junction point, run in when the house was being built ? There is no easy way fibre could be brought to that same master socket position in my home. Therefore, a new master socket would be needed in my home on a wall that could allow Openreach to connect via a quite different external wall ? Would they install the new run required to get the fibre across my front garden to the new wall position well, or just a few inches below my roses? Or would they insist on running the fibre to the position of their existing external wall point which is a totally impractical position for internal connection to anything? Oh dear. 4. My ISP, Plusnet, if I were to ask to be moved to FTP with them would ditch my copper landline (of course) BUT they do not provide any SIP/ VOIP solution / equivalent for any kind of Landline-like facility. If I objected to the loss of any ?landline, with or without an existing landline number even via SIP/ VOIP?, they would just help me to sign-up to BT Broadband instead and discard me as their customer, giving me to BT. That?s their current policy! (Now, I know some might be wondering why I want to keep my existing Landline number? I have had it for 30+years, everyone knows it ? from friends in USA who only fly into Blighty once a decade to friends and businesses who have the number to contact me on, and sometimes to prove it is me talking with them) 5. The BT ?Voice? implementation of SIP/ VOIP is propriety to them only. You MUST use their provided router for their BT Voice system to work, no other than the BT Modem will work with BT Voice. Anyone who has their own Wireless router or Wi-Fi-Mesh system to provide better Wi-Fi coverage around the home (better than the bog-standard ISP-provided Wireless router) would find the continued use of that better kit practically impossible because of how the ?necessary? BT Modem (for the Propriety BT Voice system to work) does not allow use of a wireless router alongside it. 6. I have extensions for my landline around the house; I have phones scattered around the home for my convenience; some are just DECT phones but others are wired into the BT master socket via wired extension sockets. Should the power fail, I can pick up a phone on such a wired extension (in the bedroom, say) and be able to call out, still. How many phones do you get with the standard BT Voice ?solution?? One. 7. The separate 50+ companies who are all beavering away installing Fibre into the UK streets ? How many of those 50+ companies are going to survive financially long-term, and when a number may fail because they have big upfront costs to still be funded long before any return from FTP adoptions comes in, who is going to adopt the customers (+ the particular fibre kit of the failed companies & their broadband provision), customers who were relying on this now-bankrupted company for their broadband? 8. Funnily enough, with a couple of UPSs already in my home, the loss of a power-cut- proofed phone is one of my least concerns about being moved to FTP, like it or not, by 2026! Am I being silly, a luddite, and should I have abandoned a landline that everyone knows how to contact me via, and gone mobile only? Should I embrace this offer for an increased broadband speed that I don?t need despite all the apparent downsides of FTP? 9. We all enjoy choice ? I chose Plusnet as my Broadband provider ? Each to their own, for cost, regional availability, decent customer service and/or other features. Yet this national FTP project seems to be making this freedom of choice more difficult unless you are willing to lose features that that your current broadband provider offers (e.g., In my case, the free option of being able to choose a Fixed-IP address for my incoming broadband with Plusnet ? (BT do not allow this unless you have a Business package with them)). I?m hoping that, as a happy reliable FTC user and with the copper link between that cabinet fibre and my home only 30 years old, I will be one of the last to be forced over to FTP and by then (2026?) maybe the negatives I have listed above will have been addressed? Ha! Thanks for your time, and any positive corrections to my thinking! Steve (Lowry) -----Original Message----- From: Tech1 On Behalf Of paul--- via Tech1 Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2023 11:52 PM To: 'Peter Fox' ; 'Nick Ware' Cc: Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk; 'Hugh Snape' Subject: Re: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare Hi Pete, I believe BT Open Reach target for all SIP / VOIP phones has slipped to December 2025 already, although they are pressing ahead with it as are Virgin Media. I get my services from Virgin and had a line issue with my Land Line a couple of weeks ago. The engineer told me they were rolling the new SIP/ VOIP phones area by area and my area was due in a few months' time. As a result, I had my 'upgrade' there and then as it would save me a visit in a few months and he was not re run the cable just for a few weeks. About 10mins and all was sorted on the new system. Only downside is your home power goes off so does your phone (As its not powered from the exchange now - no reduction in price even though they are no longer powering it!) If you ask for a back up they will provide a battery backed phone which uses a SIM if the line goes. No charge , but you have to ask. Your own mobile is probably a better back up. I did ask for there back up, but looking at the size, put it back in its box and away. I suspect if you have a Burglar alarm/ panic alarm or medical emergency alarm on your current phone, you could be in to a world of pain to swap over. Paul Paul Thackray PGT Media Consulting Ltd. +44 7802 243979 Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Web; https://www.pgtmedia.co.uk/ Linkedin; https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fuk.linkedin.com%2Fpub%2Fpaul-thackray%2F19%2F379%2F746&data=05%7C01%7C%7C5a3ad6eabf294aa593d308db355f4ec7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638162455684810721%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=Q4cE0yBS4cm%2BFGZ43Pwbw%2BWoObtBUsZ1xSSXvILkkc0%3D&reserved=0 IMDB; https://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ -----Original Message----- From: Tech1 On Behalf Of Peter Fox via Tech1 Sent: 04 April 2023 22:38 To: Nick Ware Cc: Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk; Hugh Snape Subject: Re: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare Open Reach have been busy festooning our telegraph poles with fibre break-out boxes. I haven't noticed anyone changing overhead cables yet (for fttp) but as BT are planning to ditch copper everywhere by 2024 (allegedly) I guess its going to happen to all of us before too long. And maybe HS2 will reach Euston before it sinks beneath the waves Peter Fox On 4 Apr 2023, at 22:22, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: ?The trouble with TalkTalk is that the one thing you can?t do is TalkTo them! N. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad On 4 Apr 2023, at 15:05, Hugh Snape wrote: ?As a disgruntled, long term, TalkTalk customer I would consider Box but unfortunately its service isn?t available in South Devon. NB, our speeds with TalkTalk are quite good 69.8 down, 13.5 up, but a bit variable, the problems arrive if there?s a fault when TT is an absolute pain to deal with . . . Hugh Snape On 4 Apr 2023, at 14:48, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: Ours was corroded old copper all the way. At best 16 Mb/sec down and 2 up, and often nothing at all, and was sold as ?faster fibre? for ?34 per month. With Box I could have 1Gb/sec up and down for that amount, but don?t have a need for it. Cheers, Nick. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad On 4 Apr 2023, at 13:56, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: ?My first ISP was Argonet (dial up) as they were Acorn friendly They got taken over after a few years, and that company got taken over by TalkTalk. By this time, of course, on broadband. And TalkTalk would send me emails saying they couldn't contact me by email. And it broke down regularly. Every time at 'their' end. But since they had to pay BT (or Open Reach) to fix it (phone still working normally) they went through the same annoying checks suggesting it was my end. When BT installed FTC, I changed to them, and it has been near 100% reliable. And since I get 80/30 Mbps with FTC, I've not bothered to upgrade to full fibre. On 04/04/2023 13:37, Nick Ware via Tech1 wrote: I was intrigued to note that Which? has rated TalkTalk as the worst phone/internet provider. Our saga still continues ?.gave notice to leave them on October24th, which they agreed to happen on Nov 14th with nothing further to pay. So stopped further direct debits. And then the fun started! We?re up to 40 emails now from ?no-reply? sources, still inviting me to renew my long since ended contract. But most of them demanding that I log into my (closed) account and pay escalating back payments and penalties. Plus, of course a flood of letters that I don?t intend to reply to. ChatBOTs are all geared towards customer retention and nothing else. Live agents are all either unintelligible - from the other side of the World - and/or useless, needless to say. Box Broadband, on the other hand, brought a genuinely fast fibre to the house, with free installation and router, plus the first three months free, and have been amazingly helpful, with an actual office here in Cranleigh that I can walk into anytime and get offered a coffee! And all that for ?10 per month cheaper than TalkTalk. On Sunday night I uploaded a 231GB file folder to the US that I couldn?t have done before, and got paid for doing. Cheers, N. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad -- Dave Plowman London, SW -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alanaudio at me.com Wed Apr 5 11:57:27 2023 From: alanaudio at me.com (Alan Taylor) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 17:57:27 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <78017C95-29FB-42C1-A8C7-589F4919D04B@me.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chris at chriswoolf.co.uk Thu Apr 6 04:39:35 2023 From: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk (Chris Woolf) Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2023 10:39:35 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: <897BE736-558E-4013-B54C-7EEC91013206@talktalk.net> References: <9B06BB8D-47D0-4F4D-A151-53DD3F930A15@icloud.com> <1ced8875-0ad5-01c0-b4fe-7976fada8f60@chriswoolf.co.uk> <897BE736-558E-4013-B54C-7EEC91013206@talktalk.net> Message-ID: <0738aa40-a0d3-ed25-aeb9-947cc81da1bc@chriswoolf.co.uk> On 05/04/2023 14:34, Hugh Snape wrote: > The overhead copper reaches our house comes by a rather convoluted route, down the side of our garden to a pole in the corner, then across the bottom of two neighbours gardens to another pole by the road.... Before all the renovation work BT used a vaguely similar scheme with a hop across the lane from a local pole to a box on the side of the house. Every few years the maintenance teams would come round and measure the overhead - "too low - needs to clear a double-decker bus". The idea of getting even a single-decker along our lane is laughable, but every time they came out with this comment .... and they never did anything about changing the pole or box. Burying everything proved far simpler and more accessible. Chris Woolf > From barry-wilkinson at sky.com Thu Apr 6 04:57:26 2023 From: barry-wilkinson at sky.com (B Wilkinson) Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2023 10:57:26 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] TalkTalk - still a nightmare In-Reply-To: <0738aa40-a0d3-ed25-aeb9-947cc81da1bc@chriswoolf.co.uk> References: <0738aa40-a0d3-ed25-aeb9-947cc81da1bc@chriswoolf.co.uk> Message-ID: <2C30EDAB-9E1A-4874-8150-3D59A1295FEE@sky.com> I live on the ? Wrong side? of a busy dual carriageway over which the poled cabled telephone and electricity supplies have to come. I have a large wooden electricity pole near to the house which is ugly but necessary . We have no gas supply. The gas people said it would cost me around ?10000 to get the gas people to run a pipe under that road plus any costs of running the pipes to the dozen or so houses on my side of the highway. Not much desire any more for a gas supply as electricity seems to be the future. Unless anyone has a spare tunnel boring machine I could borrow cheaply I think any future fibre phone connection will have to come over via poles?.probably not in my lifetime! Annoyingly there is a major gas pipe running about a mile away from the Irish Sea gas fields to the grid, but maybe the pressure would have been a bit excessive to connect directly to that in the past. Sent from my iPad > On 6 Apr 2023, at 10:40, Chris Woolf via Tech1 wrote: > > ? >> On 05/04/2023 14:34, Hugh Snape wrote: >> The overhead copper reaches our house comes by a rather convoluted route, down the side of our garden to a pole in the corner, then across the bottom of two neighbours gardens to another pole by the road.... > > Before all the renovation work BT used a vaguely similar scheme with a hop across the lane from a local pole to a box on the side of the house. Every few years the maintenance teams would come round and measure the overhead - "too low - needs to clear a double-decker bus". The idea of getting even a single-decker along our lane is laughable, but every time they came out with this comment .... and they never did anything about changing the pole or box. > > Burying everything proved far simpler and more accessible. > > Chris Woolf > >> > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From mikej at bmanor.co.uk Thu Apr 6 04:58:24 2023 From: mikej at bmanor.co.uk (Mike Jordan) Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2023 10:58:24 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Saving Riverside Studios Message-ID: Apparently City Hall is looking for ways to stop it closing. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-65198944 And The Chancellors? My memories only go back to about 3 years of TFIfriday and even further to sort out wires for The Boat Race when that was the main site in about 1967! Mike -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From barry-wilkinson at sky.com Sat Apr 8 07:41:37 2023 From: barry-wilkinson at sky.com (B Wilkinson) Date: Sat, 8 Apr 2023 13:41:37 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) References: <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE.ref@sky.com> Message-ID: <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE@sky.com> I keep reading in the Press how the State Pension has risen due to the triple lock. They don?t even call it the New State Pension any more . Those of us who started taking our pensions pre 2016 are on a considerably lower payout than post 2016 pensioners as many of you will know. So the cumulative effect of percentage rises for us old crusties compared with the New Pensioners is that we get further and further behind in cash terms . It?s about time this was put right as New Pensioners didn?t have to contribute over the years as much as Old Pensioners. So every time the government and the press say how generous the increase in pensions is this year I get very annoyed and need to vent my anger. The problem is there is nobody to complain to. The government don?t care as it saves them money and there doesn?t seem to be any group trying to put things right. Mr Angry Sent from my iPad From graeme.wall at icloud.com Sat Apr 8 08:20:46 2023 From: graeme.wall at icloud.com (Graeme Wall) Date: Sat, 8 Apr 2023 14:20:46 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) In-Reply-To: <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE@sky.com> References: <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE.ref@sky.com> <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE@sky.com> Message-ID: <06B0ACAE-F542-403B-A5B8-BC24ED76EFF0@icloud.com> Totally agree Disgusting of Tunbridge Wells > On 8 Apr 2023, at 13:41, B Wilkinson via Tech1 wrote: > > I keep reading in the Press how the State Pension has risen due to the triple lock. They don?t even call it the New State Pension any more . Those of us who started taking our pensions pre 2016 are on a considerably lower payout than post 2016 pensioners as many of you will know. So the cumulative effect of percentage rises for us old crusties compared with the New Pensioners is that we get further and further behind in cash terms . It?s about time this was put right as New Pensioners didn?t have to contribute over the years as much as Old Pensioners. > So every time the government and the press say how generous the increase in pensions is this year I get very annoyed and need to vent my anger. > The problem is there is nobody to complain to. The government don?t care as it saves them money and there doesn?t seem to be any group trying to put things right. > Mr Angry > > Sent from my iPad > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk ? Graeme Wall From paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Wed Apr 12 14:10:30 2023 From: paul at pgtmedia.co.uk (Paul Thackray) Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2023 20:10:30 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) In-Reply-To: <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE@sky.com> References: <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE.ref@sky.com> <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE@sky.com> Message-ID: <014101d96d72$72ce43c0$586acb40$@pgtmedia.co.uk> Hi all, I am sure I will get shot down in flames for saying this, but in lots of cases it's very difficult to work out who is winning and who is losing in the different State Pension versions. A straight old pension v new pension is not comparing like for like in any way. Its extremely dependent on your work history, sex and a few ?strange? edge cases as the system was changed at various dates. Looking at a few examples. Someone now in their 80?s, who worked as a staff member, but did not have a company pension or and was not contracted out would get Old State Pension + Full SERPS / Second Pension. The Old Pension has gone up using the Triple lock (Like the New) but the Second Pension / SERPS has only gone up by CPI (Maybe 1% is the Triple lock-CPI on ? of the pension) So 0.25%(?) behind those on a new pension. It looks like they are losing, except if you compare someone at the age of 80 today, they have been paid the state pension for 15 years or 20 years (Depending if they are a Man or a Woman) Compare that with anyone who is 60 today, will only get paid 13 years of payments at the new rate. (And likely had to contribute for 5-7 more years of working life) By the time they reach 80. In this comparison those on the Old + SERPS are defiantly not losers in comparison with people who have yet to retire at 67. If you were staff & had a works pension, you were likely contracted out, paying less in to the state system (as it was diverted to a Company pension, you should be benefiting from) Hence its only fair as you paid less in, you get less out of the state system. For Freelancers, you were not allowed to pay in to the State Second Pension. You paid lower contributions and were supposed to invest this in a private pension. It would be unfair for those who paid lower contributions to get the same as those that paid in full. (If you did not invest it, then that was a choice you made then that you might be regretting now, but it was a choice. ? sorry if this seam harsh, but it?s is fair?) The Government talk of the Old & New pension is not helpful. It's really all smoke and mirrors. Quite a few on the ?New Pension ? do not get the quoted figure. You only get the full amount if you were never Freelance before 2016, Never Contracted out and have 35 years of full contributions. To give my example, I have 46 years of NI contributions, but will not get a Full New State Pension (At 67) unless I get another year on my NI Records before I get to 67. Its all a very unfair system (?) Some years I have paid ?0 , this counted as ?a year? some years I paid around ?3,900 this also counted as ?a year? towards my 35 I need (Which is actually 47 needed?.) (This may cause some discussion....) Paul Paul Thackray PGT Media Consulting Ltd. 07802 243979 Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ -----Original Message----- From: Tech1 On Behalf Of B Wilkinson via Tech1 Sent: 08 April 2023 13:42 To: tech1 Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) I keep reading in the Press how the State Pension has risen due to the triple lock. They don?t even call it the New State Pension any more . Those of us who started taking our pensions pre 2016 are on a considerably lower payout than post 2016 pensioners as many of you will know. So the cumulative effect of percentage rises for us old crusties compared with the New Pensioners is that we get further and further behind in cash terms . It?s about time this was put right as New Pensioners didn?t have to contribute over the years as much as Old Pensioners. So every time the government and the press say how generous the increase in pensions is this year I get very annoyed and need to vent my anger. The problem is there is nobody to complain to. The government don?t care as it saves them money and there doesn?t seem to be any group trying to put things right. Mr Angry Sent from my iPad -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From chris at chriswoolf.co.uk Thu Apr 13 04:52:25 2023 From: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk (Chris Woolf) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2023 10:52:25 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) In-Reply-To: <014101d96d72$72ce43c0$586acb40$@pgtmedia.co.uk> References: <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE.ref@sky.com> <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE@sky.com> <014101d96d72$72ce43c0$586acb40$@pgtmedia.co.uk> Message-ID: <8b1c62aa-38e5-30af-1291-507ac52dec7f@chriswoolf.co.uk> You are so right - trying to unravel the staggeringly complicated pension rules is all but impossible for most people. Cards on table - no point in being coy. The government pension for me has just been put up to give ?421 /week. I'm 75, and have paid NI for all the years I worked. I also did the SERPS thing - there wasn't a lot of choice when they started it up with various bribes. Since I've been a freelance most of my working life I also made small (?50/month) private contributions, and added in the odd extra lump sum when possible. I was still finding work through my company when I reached 65 (my retirement age) and so deferred my pension. At 10.25% / annum increase that was a massive benefit, and I only put the lid on that a couple of years ago when it looked as if the chancellor might axe that lucrative scheme. I had to take my private pension last year since I wasn't allowed to keep it past 75. Wanted to invest it in a rental property for a friend, but sadly you can't do that - the restrictions on using "your" money are ludicrous. The system is rigged so that the insurance and banking companies make the most out of your money. When my first wife died (2009) I needed to sell my house - didn't like living in it any longer - so I sold it to some friends. They couldn't afford a sensible price so I gave them a private mortgage for half of it. Thus I get a respectable income from that too - it forms a useful chunk of "pension". And my business still provides a comfortable income currently, though I cannot tell how much longer that will continue. Together with putting spare capital into the renovation of my current house, as much to make it long-term inexpensive to run as anything else, income, expenditure and tax outgoings all balance up tolerably well ... at the moment. Largely by chance - certainly not long-term planning - I've ended up with an acceptable income which means I don't have to watch every penny, thank goodness. But if you asked a pension advisor about any of that lot you would get some weird looks. Chris Woolf On 12/04/2023 20:10, Paul Thackray via Tech1 wrote: > Hi all, > I am sure I will get shot down in flames for saying this, but in lots of cases it's very difficult to work out who is winning and who is losing in the different State Pension versions. A straight old pension v new pension is not comparing like for like in any way. Its extremely dependent on your work history, sex and a few ?strange? edge cases as the system was changed at various dates. > > Looking at a few examples. > > Someone now in their 80?s, who worked as a staff member, but did not have a company pension or and was not contracted out would get Old State Pension + Full SERPS / Second Pension. The Old Pension has gone up using the Triple lock (Like the New) but the Second Pension / SERPS has only gone up by CPI (Maybe 1% is the Triple lock-CPI on ? of the pension) So 0.25%(?) behind those on a new pension. It looks like they are losing, except if you compare someone at the age of 80 today, they have been paid the state pension for 15 years or 20 years (Depending if they are a Man or a Woman) Compare that with anyone who is 60 today, will only get paid 13 years of payments at the new rate. (And likely had to contribute for 5-7 more years of working life) By the time they reach 80. > In this comparison those on the Old + SERPS are defiantly not losers in comparison with people who have yet to retire at 67. > > > If you were staff & had a works pension, you were likely contracted out, paying less in to the state system (as it was diverted to a Company pension, you should be benefiting from) Hence its only fair as you paid less in, you get less out of the state system. > > > For Freelancers, you were not allowed to pay in to the State Second Pension. You paid lower contributions and were supposed to invest this in a private pension. It would be unfair for those who paid lower contributions to get the same as those that paid in full. (If you did not invest it, then that was a choice you made then that you might be regretting now, but it was a choice. ? sorry if this seam harsh, but it?s is fair?) > > > The Government talk of the Old & New pension is not helpful. It's really all smoke and mirrors. Quite a few on the ?New Pension ? do not get the quoted figure. > You only get the full amount if you were never Freelance before 2016, Never Contracted out and have 35 years of full contributions. > > To give my example, I have 46 years of NI contributions, but will not get a Full New State Pension (At 67) unless I get another year on my NI Records before I get to 67. Its all a very unfair system (?) Some years I have paid ?0 , this counted as ?a year? some years I paid around ?3,900 this also counted as ?a year? towards my 35 I need (Which is actually 47 needed?.) > > (This may cause some discussion....) > Paul > > Paul Thackray > PGT Media Consulting Ltd. > 07802 243979 > Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk > Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk > Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 > IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tech1 On Behalf Of B Wilkinson via Tech1 > Sent: 08 April 2023 13:42 > To: tech1 > Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) > > I keep reading in the Press how the State Pension has risen due to the triple lock. They don?t even call it the New State Pension any more . Those of us who started taking our pensions pre 2016 are on a considerably lower payout than post 2016 pensioners as many of you will know. So the cumulative effect of percentage rises for us old crusties compared with the New Pensioners is that we get further and further behind in cash terms . It?s about time this was put right as New Pensioners didn?t have to contribute over the years as much as Old Pensioners. > So every time the government and the press say how generous the increase in pensions is this year I get very annoyed and need to vent my anger. > The problem is there is nobody to complain to. The government don?t care as it saves them money and there doesn?t seem to be any group trying to put things right. > Mr Angry > > Sent from my iPad > From plowmandave44 at gmail.com Thu Apr 13 05:00:12 2023 From: plowmandave44 at gmail.com (Dave Plowman) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2023 11:00:12 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) In-Reply-To: <8b1c62aa-38e5-30af-1291-507ac52dec7f@chriswoolf.co.uk> References: <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE.ref@sky.com> <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE@sky.com> <014101d96d72$72ce43c0$586acb40$@pgtmedia.co.uk> <8b1c62aa-38e5-30af-1291-507ac52dec7f@chriswoolf.co.uk> Message-ID: Think there have to be restrictions on how a pension pot is used. There are already far too many looking to fleece you of savings. And individuals capable of making poor decisions. But laws to prevent a person from themselves are always going to be contentious. On 13/04/2023 10:52, Chris Woolf via Tech1 wrote: > You are so right - trying to unravel the staggeringly complicated > pension rules is all but impossible for most people. > > Cards on table - no point in being coy. The government pension for me > has just been put up to give ?421 /week. I'm 75, and have paid NI for > all the years I worked. I also did the SERPS thing - there wasn't a lot > of choice when they started it up with various bribes. Since I've been a > freelance most of my working life I also made small (?50/month) private > contributions, and added in the odd extra lump sum when possible. > > I was still finding work through my company when I reached 65 (my > retirement age) and so deferred my pension. At 10.25% / annum increase > that was a massive benefit, and I only put the lid on that a couple of > years ago when it looked as if the chancellor might axe that lucrative > scheme. > > I had to take my private pension last year since I wasn't allowed to > keep it past 75. Wanted to invest it in a rental property for a friend, > but sadly you can't do that - the restrictions on using "your" money are > ludicrous. The system is rigged so that the insurance and banking > companies make the most out of your money. > > When my first wife died (2009) I needed to sell my house - didn't like > living in it any longer - so I sold it to some friends. They couldn't > afford a sensible price so I gave them a private mortgage for half of > it. Thus I get a respectable income from that too - it forms a useful > chunk of "pension". > > And my business still provides a comfortable income currently, though I > cannot tell how much longer that will continue. Together with putting > spare capital into the renovation of my current house, as much to make > it long-term inexpensive to run as anything else, income, expenditure > and tax outgoings all balance up tolerably well ... at the moment. > > Largely by chance - certainly not long-term planning - I've ended up > with an acceptable income which means I don't have to watch every penny, > thank goodness. > > But if you asked a pension advisor about any of that lot you would get > some weird looks. > > > Chris Woolf > > > On 12/04/2023 20:10, Paul Thackray via Tech1 wrote: >> Hi all, >> I am sure I will get shot down in flames for saying this, but in lots >> of cases it's very difficult to work out who is winning and who is >> losing in the different State Pension versions. A straight old pension >> v new pension is not comparing like for like in any way. Its extremely >> dependent on your work history, sex and a few ?strange? edge cases as >> the system was changed at various dates. >> >> Looking at a few examples. >> >> Someone now in their 80?s, who worked as a staff member, but did not >> have a company pension or and was not contracted out would get Old >> State Pension + Full SERPS / Second Pension. The Old Pension has gone >> up using the Triple lock (Like the New) but the Second Pension / SERPS >> has only gone up by CPI (Maybe 1% is the Triple lock-CPI on ? of the >> pension) So 0.25%(?) behind those on a new pension. It looks like they >> are losing, except if you compare someone at the age of 80 today, they >> have been paid the state pension for 15 years or 20 years (Depending >> if they are a Man or a Woman) Compare that with anyone who is 60 >> today, will only get paid 13 years of payments at the new rate. (And >> likely had to contribute for 5-7 more years of working life) By the >> time they reach 80. >> In this comparison those on the Old + SERPS are defiantly not losers >> in comparison with people who have yet to retire at 67. >> >> >> If you were staff & had a works pension, you were likely contracted >> out, paying less in to the state system (as it was diverted to a >> Company pension, you should be benefiting from) Hence its only fair as >> you paid less in, you get less out of the state system. >> >> >> For Freelancers, you were not allowed to pay in to the State Second >> Pension. You paid lower contributions and were supposed to invest this >> in a private pension. It would be unfair for those who paid lower >> contributions to get the same as those that paid in full. (If you did >> not invest it, then that was a choice you made then that you might be >> regretting now, but it was a choice. ? sorry if this seam harsh, but >> it?s is fair?) >> >> >> The Government talk of the Old & New pension is not helpful. It's >> really all smoke and mirrors. Quite a few on the ?New Pension ? do not >> get the quoted figure. >> You only get the full amount if you were never Freelance before 2016, >> Never Contracted out and have 35 years of full contributions. >> >> To give my example, I have 46 years of NI contributions, but will not >> get a Full New State Pension (At 67) unless I get another year on my >> NI Records before I get to 67. Its all a very unfair system (?) Some >> years I have paid ?0 , this counted as ?a year? some years I paid >> around ?3,900 this also counted as ?a year? towards my 35 I need >> (Which is actually 47 needed?.) >> >> (This may cause some discussion....) >> Paul >> >> Paul Thackray >> PGT Media Consulting Ltd. >> 07802 243979 >> Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk >> Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk >> Linkedin;?? http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 >> IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Tech1 On Behalf Of B Wilkinson >> via Tech1 >> Sent: 08 April 2023 13:42 >> To: tech1 >> Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the >> correct group) >> >> I keep reading in the Press how the State Pension has risen due to the >> triple lock. They don?t even call it the New State Pension any more . >> Those of us who? started taking our pensions pre 2016 are on a >> considerably lower payout than post 2016 pensioners as many of you >> will know. So the cumulative effect of percentage rises for us old >> crusties compared with the New Pensioners is that we get further and >> further behind in cash terms . It?s about time this was put right as >> New Pensioners didn?t have to contribute over the years as much as Old >> Pensioners. >> So every time the government and the press say how generous the >> increase in pensions is this year I get very annoyed and need to vent >> my anger. >> The problem is there is nobody to complain to. The government don?t >> care as it saves them money and there doesn?t seem to be any group >> trying to put things right. >> Mr Angry >> >> Sent from my iPad >> > -- Dave Plowman London, SW From barry-wilkinson at sky.com Thu Apr 13 06:06:07 2023 From: barry-wilkinson at sky.com (B Wilkinson) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2023 12:06:07 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Admittedly I have been lucky due to circumstances beyond my control and just choosing a career in line with my interests. I started at the BBC in 1967 as a technical operator in Cardiff( the BBC?s decision!) and gradually moved from sound to cameras at BBC Manchester. For various reasons , especially having every weekend off I moved to Granada in Manchester as a cameraman and ending up at Granada Lancaster as a regional news cameraman, a job I loved. Pension wise , once I was allowed to join the Granada pension scheme my BBC pension was transferred to theirs . I was told later by a Granada pensions adviser that this had been a good move , but I have no idea why. Eventually at 57 I was offered the chance to take early ( technically compulsory) retirement from Granada/ ITV with a cash payout. I used some of that to buy some camera gear which allowed me to both continue freelancing for ITV and a few other jobs including wedding videos( the hardest jobs I had ever done!!) I was also able to take a slightly reduced ITV pension due to retiring 3 years before the normal ITV retirement age. I took my state pension at 65 and shortly afterwards stopped work to concentrate on the important things in life. I continued to pay National insurance during my freelance work and ended up with enough years for a full state pension. After a few years of taking the ITV pension I was offered a deal. This was a 25% uplift in payout which was then mostly frozen at that level. Everyone thought I was daft to accept the offer but I reasoned that it was better to have more money immediately rather than later in life. I was lucky in that after taking that boost ,inflation stayed low for many years . So I have to admit that now, despite the rise in inflation ,my wife and I are comfortably off and very lucky. My state pension has just risen this month from ?655.52 per month to ?759.65 per month but due to the change with the New Pension scheme is not as high as later retirees. OK I am comfortably well off ,but someone depending entirely on their state pension would seem to be losing out. I was told that later retirees did not have to put in as many pensionable years as I had to, and get a higher pension, but the system is so complicated, despite studying A level maths I find the rules baffling. It needs sorting so that the man in the street can fully understand it. Sent from my iPad > On 13 Apr 2023, at 11:00, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: > > ?Think there have to be restrictions on how a pension pot is used. There are already far too many looking to fleece you of savings. And individuals capable of making poor decisions. But laws to prevent a person from themselves are always going to be contentious. > >> On 13/04/2023 10:52, Chris Woolf via Tech1 wrote: >> You are so right - trying to unravel the staggeringly complicated pension rules is all but impossible for most people. >> Cards on table - no point in being coy. The government pension for me has just been put up to give ?421 /week. I'm 75, and have paid NI for all the years I worked. I also did the SERPS thing - there wasn't a lot of choice when they started it up with various bribes. Since I've been a freelance most of my working life I also made small (?50/month) private contributions, and added in the odd extra lump sum when possible. >> I was still finding work through my company when I reached 65 (my retirement age) and so deferred my pension. At 10.25% / annum increase that was a massive benefit, and I only put the lid on that a couple of years ago when it looked as if the chancellor might axe that lucrative scheme. >> I had to take my private pension last year since I wasn't allowed to keep it past 75. Wanted to invest it in a rental property for a friend, but sadly you can't do that - the restrictions on using "your" money are ludicrous. The system is rigged so that the insurance and banking companies make the most out of your money. >> When my first wife died (2009) I needed to sell my house - didn't like living in it any longer - so I sold it to some friends. They couldn't afford a sensible price so I gave them a private mortgage for half of it. Thus I get a respectable income from that too - it forms a useful chunk of "pension". >> And my business still provides a comfortable income currently, though I cannot tell how much longer that will continue. Together with putting spare capital into the renovation of my current house, as much to make it long-term inexpensive to run as anything else, income, expenditure and tax outgoings all balance up tolerably well ... at the moment. >> Largely by chance - certainly not long-term planning - I've ended up with an acceptable income which means I don't have to watch every penny, thank goodness. >> But if you asked a pension advisor about any of that lot you would get some weird looks. >> Chris Woolf >>> On 12/04/2023 20:10, Paul Thackray via Tech1 wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> I am sure I will get shot down in flames for saying this, but in lots of cases it's very difficult to work out who is winning and who is losing in the different State Pension versions. A straight old pension v new pension is not comparing like for like in any way. Its extremely dependent on your work history, sex and a few ?strange? edge cases as the system was changed at various dates. >>> >>> Looking at a few examples. >>> >>> Someone now in their 80?s, who worked as a staff member, but did not have a company pension or and was not contracted out would get Old State Pension + Full SERPS / Second Pension. The Old Pension has gone up using the Triple lock (Like the New) but the Second Pension / SERPS has only gone up by CPI (Maybe 1% is the Triple lock-CPI on ? of the pension) So 0.25%(?) behind those on a new pension. It looks like they are losing, except if you compare someone at the age of 80 today, they have been paid the state pension for 15 years or 20 years (Depending if they are a Man or a Woman) Compare that with anyone who is 60 today, will only get paid 13 years of payments at the new rate. (And likely had to contribute for 5-7 more years of working life) By the time they reach 80. >>> In this comparison those on the Old + SERPS are defiantly not losers in comparison with people who have yet to retire at 67. >>> >>> >>> If you were staff & had a works pension, you were likely contracted out, paying less in to the state system (as it was diverted to a Company pension, you should be benefiting from) Hence its only fair as you paid less in, you get less out of the state system. >>> >>> >>> For Freelancers, you were not allowed to pay in to the State Second Pension. You paid lower contributions and were supposed to invest this in a private pension. It would be unfair for those who paid lower contributions to get the same as those that paid in full. (If you did not invest it, then that was a choice you made then that you might be regretting now, but it was a choice. ? sorry if this seam harsh, but it?s is fair?) >>> >>> >>> The Government talk of the Old & New pension is not helpful. It's really all smoke and mirrors. Quite a few on the ?New Pension ? do not get the quoted figure. >>> You only get the full amount if you were never Freelance before 2016, Never Contracted out and have 35 years of full contributions. >>> >>> To give my example, I have 46 years of NI contributions, but will not get a Full New State Pension (At 67) unless I get another year on my NI Records before I get to 67. Its all a very unfair system (?) Some years I have paid ?0 , this counted as ?a year? some years I paid around ?3,900 this also counted as ?a year? towards my 35 I need (Which is actually 47 needed?.) >>> >>> (This may cause some discussion....) >>> Paul >>> >>> Paul Thackray >>> PGT Media Consulting Ltd. >>> 07802 243979 >>> Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk >>> Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk >>> Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 >>> IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Tech1 On Behalf Of B Wilkinson via Tech1 >>> Sent: 08 April 2023 13:42 >>> To: tech1 >>> Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) >>> >>> I keep reading in the Press how the State Pension has risen due to the triple lock. They don?t even call it the New State Pension any more . Those of us who started taking our pensions pre 2016 are on a considerably lower payout than post 2016 pensioners as many of you will know. So the cumulative effect of percentage rises for us old crusties compared with the New Pensioners is that we get further and further behind in cash terms . It?s about time this was put right as New Pensioners didn?t have to contribute over the years as much as Old Pensioners. >>> So every time the government and the press say how generous the increase in pensions is this year I get very annoyed and need to vent my anger. >>> The problem is there is nobody to complain to. The government don?t care as it saves them money and there doesn?t seem to be any group trying to put things right. >>> Mr Angry >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> > > -- > Dave Plowman > London, SW > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From chris at chriswoolf.co.uk Thu Apr 13 06:07:04 2023 From: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk (Chris Woolf) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2023 12:07:04 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) In-Reply-To: References: <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE.ref@sky.com> <48CE9980-1831-4ED4-A44F-F901638C58FE@sky.com> <014101d96d72$72ce43c0$586acb40$@pgtmedia.co.uk> <8b1c62aa-38e5-30af-1291-507ac52dec7f@chriswoolf.co.uk> Message-ID: On 13/04/2023 11:00, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: > Think there have to be restrictions on how a pension pot is used. > There are already far too many looking to fleece you of savings. And > individuals capable of making poor decisions. But laws to prevent a > person from themselves are always going to be contentious. > Not only contentious, but also misguided in many cases. The idea was to provide money to buy a home for a close friend - he is income rich (from a pension) and capital poor, so could pay me a good rent, and I would have complete security of the money - a win for both of us since he would know the landlord wouldn't throw him out on a whim in 5 years time, and I would have a reliable income. But I'm not allowed to do that unless I pay a massive tax bill on the capital sum in the first place. If it was a hotel, a hospital, a prison, a restaurant, (probably even a brothel) it would be allowed, even though it would be infinitely more risky. But domestic property? No! These restrictive schemes may be put in for good reasons but presume a set of standardised conditions for people's lives that often don't exist. The same goes for many of the benefits schemes that make assumptions about people's lives, relationships and working patterns that are out of date or even imaginary. The nuclear family, the average two children, the full time job (but only /one/ job), the "benefit scrounger", the feckless single mother - things that politicians believe, and form laws around, even though these fail to work because the world is actually very different. Chris Woolf -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alanaudio at me.com Thu Apr 13 07:04:45 2023 From: alanaudio at me.com (Alan Taylor) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2023 13:04:45 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <35F67B44-42CC-4E8F-9B26-04528DA49818@me.com> I get very frustrated trying to deal with professional advisers who want everything to fit into a familiar pattern. While my wife is working, I have little need of drawing my pension. The house is paid for and her income together with my state pension comfortably covers our living expenses together with a few luxuries. Her pension will be pretty rubbish, so the intention is to leave my pension largely untouched until she retires and then both live primarily off my pension. A drawdown pension seems to be the ideal arrangement. However my pension fund won?t let me transfer my pension to a drawdown until I?ve consulted a financial adviser. The one I tried was hugely unimpressive and was trying to steer me towards financial products which I didn?t think suited my circumstances. My son is an accountant and agrees that the proposed options were unsuitable. Similarly when I first bought some shares, I was advised that the shares were too risky and that investing elsewhere would be a better idea. As it happens, I stuck with my intention to invest in a technology company and saw the share price multiply elevenfold in about a decade and do quite well subsequently. I was able to sell a bunch of shares to buy my current house and still have a substantial sum invested. If I had followed the advice of the professional, I would have lost pretty well all of it as his suggestion was to invest in a company which went bust. Much earlier, when I was moving house in the 1980s, I was being strongly steered towards an endowment mortgage. I wasn?t convinced it was a good. idea for my circumstances and had quite a battle to get a standard repayment mortgage arranged swiftly ( I needed to complete rapidly or would have lost that house ). I know that some people did well from endowment mortgages, but a cousin took out an endowment mortgage at about that same time and it didn?t work out at all well for him, while my repayment mortgage was great as I overpaid it when my income was unexpectedly high and I paid off the mortgage well ahead of time. It put me into a good position when starting out freelancing as I didn?t have that huge monthly repayment hanging over my head every month. My conclusion is that not all professionals are experts. If you find a good one, they?re great, but too many of them try to follow a well trodden path which suits some, but not all. The challenge is trying to find one who is going to work well for you. Alan > On 13 Apr 2023, at 12:07, Chris Woolf via Tech1 wrote: > ? The same goes for many of the benefits schemes that make assumptions about people's lives, relationships and working patterns that are out of date or even imaginary. The nuclear family, the average two children, the full time job (but only one job), the "benefit scrounger", the feckless single mother - things that politicians believe, and form laws around, even though these fail to work because the world is actually very different. > Chris Woolf -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From graeme.wall at icloud.com Thu Apr 13 07:53:28 2023 From: graeme.wall at icloud.com (Graeme Wall) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2023 13:53:28 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) In-Reply-To: <35F67B44-42CC-4E8F-9B26-04528DA49818@me.com> References: <35F67B44-42CC-4E8F-9B26-04528DA49818@me.com> Message-ID: I had an endowment mortgage, it matured literally weeks before the bottom fell out of that market! My financial adviser has been very good, he actually steered me into a draw-down pension which I hadn?t heard of before. I can pass you his details if you are interested. > On 13 Apr 2023, at 13:04, Alan Taylor via Tech1 wrote: > > I get very frustrated trying to deal with professional advisers who want everything to fit into a familiar pattern. > > While my wife is working, I have little need of drawing my pension. The house is paid for and her income together with my state pension comfortably covers our living expenses together with a few luxuries. Her pension will be pretty rubbish, so the intention is to leave my pension largely untouched until she retires and then both live primarily off my pension. A drawdown pension seems to be the ideal arrangement. > > However my pension fund won?t let me transfer my pension to a drawdown until I?ve consulted a financial adviser. The one I tried was hugely unimpressive and was trying to steer me towards financial products which I didn?t think suited my circumstances. My son is an accountant and agrees that the proposed options were unsuitable. > > Similarly when I first bought some shares, I was advised that the shares were too risky and that investing elsewhere would be a better idea. As it happens, I stuck with my intention to invest in a technology company and saw the share price multiply elevenfold in about a decade and do quite well subsequently. I was able to sell a bunch of shares to buy my current house and still have a substantial sum invested. If I had followed the advice of the professional, I would have lost pretty well all of it as his suggestion was to invest in a company which went bust. > > Much earlier, when I was moving house in the 1980s, I was being strongly steered towards an endowment mortgage. I wasn?t convinced it was a good. idea for my circumstances and had quite a battle to get a standard repayment mortgage arranged swiftly ( I needed to complete rapidly or would have lost that house ). I know that some people did well from endowment mortgages, but a cousin took out an endowment mortgage at about that same time and it didn?t work out at all well for him, while my repayment mortgage was great as I overpaid it when my income was unexpectedly high and I paid off the mortgage well ahead of time. It put me into a good position when starting out freelancing as I didn?t have that huge monthly repayment hanging over my head every month. > > My conclusion is that not all professionals are experts. If you find a good one, they?re great, but too many of them try to follow a well trodden path which suits some, but not all. The challenge is trying to find one who is going to work well for you. > > Alan > > > >> On 13 Apr 2023, at 12:07, Chris Woolf via Tech1 wrote: >> ? The same goes for many of the benefits schemes that make assumptions about people's lives, relationships and working patterns that are out of date or even imaginary. The nuclear family, the average two children, the full time job (but only one job), the "benefit scrounger", the feckless single mother - things that politicians believe, and form laws around, even though these fail to work because the world is actually very different. >> >> Chris Woolf > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk ? Graeme Wall From chris at chriswoolf.co.uk Thu Apr 13 07:55:41 2023 From: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk (Chris Woolf) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2023 13:55:41 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) In-Reply-To: <35F67B44-42CC-4E8F-9B26-04528DA49818@me.com> References: <35F67B44-42CC-4E8F-9B26-04528DA49818@me.com> Message-ID: <63b196ea-20a8-2c6b-828d-6992ebae8c12@chriswoolf.co.uk> On 13/04/2023 13:04, Alan Taylor via Tech1 wrote: > My conclusion is that not all professionals are experts. > Oh goodness, yes - all so true. The difficulty is that you have to become your own expert now in so many areas just to be able to judge the advice and the adviser. Without some basic grasp of the subject, the language and buzzwords, and what element of fashion is being followed, you are very likely to become the next"victim". If only it weren't just lawyers and accountants - it even goes into the medical realms, besides the more plebeian builders and car servicing. Chris Woolf From paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Thu Apr 13 08:56:23 2023 From: paul at pgtmedia.co.uk (paul at pgtmedia.co.uk) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2023 14:56:23 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The number of years required is also smoke and mirrors. In the time I have been paying NI I have been told I needed 40 then 35 then 30 and currently 35 years if you believe the headlines. (Except I know I wil not get it without 47 years. ) Once you have whatever the figure is, you still have to pay while you are working until you reach state pension age, but getting nothing for the extra payments on you pension. The other wrinkle was , when 40 years was required, you were credited with years for free if you were in full time education (from the age of 16) So if you did A levels and a 3 year university course you would start employment at 23 having not paid a penny of NI but having five years on your pension record towards your 40. This stopped around the time the required number of years fell to 35. Paul Thackray ? PGT Media Consulting Ltd. +44 7802 243979 Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk ? Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ ? Original Message ? From: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk Sent: 13 April 2023 12:06 To: plowmandave44 at gmail.com Reply to: barry-wilkinson at sky.com Cc: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk Subject: Re: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) Admittedly I have been lucky due to circumstances beyond my control and just choosing a career in line with my interests. I started at the BBC in 1967 as a technical operator in Cardiff( the BBC?s decision!) and gradually moved from sound to cameras at BBC Manchester. For various reasons , especially having every weekend off I moved to Granada in Manchester as a cameraman and ending up at Granada Lancaster as a regional news cameraman, a job I loved. Pension wise , once I was allowed to join the Granada pension scheme my BBC pension was transferred to theirs . I was told later by a Granada pensions adviser that this had been a good move , but I have no idea why. Eventually at 57 I was offered the chance to take early ( technically compulsory) retirement from Granada/ ITV with a cash payout. I used some of that to buy some camera gear which allowed me to both continue freelancing for ITV and a few other jobs including wedding videos( the hardest jobs I had ever done!!) I was also able to take a slightly reduced ITV pension due to retiring 3 years before the normal ITV retirement age. I took my state pension at 65 and shortly afterwards stopped work to concentrate on the important things in life. I continued to pay National insurance during my freelance work and ended up with enough years for a full state pension. After a few years of taking the ITV pension I was offered a deal. This was a 25% uplift in payout which was then mostly frozen at that level. Everyone thought I was? daft to accept the offer but I reasoned that it was better to have more money immediately rather than later in life. I was lucky in that after taking that boost ,inflation stayed low for many years . So I have to admit that now, despite the rise in inflation ,my wife and I are comfortably off and very lucky. My state pension has? just risen this month from ?655.52 per month to ?759.65 per month but due to the change with the New Pension scheme is not as high as later retirees. OK I am comfortably well off ,but someone depending entirely on their state pension would seem to be losing out. I was told that later retirees did not have to put in as many pensionable years as I had to, and get a higher pension, but the system is so complicated, despite studying A level maths I find the rules baffling. It needs sorting so that the man in the street can fully understand it. Sent from my iPad > On 13 Apr 2023, at 11:00, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: > > ?Think there have to be restrictions on how a pension pot is used. There are already far too many looking to fleece you of savings. And individuals capable of making poor decisions. But laws to prevent a person from themselves are always going to be contentious. > >> On 13/04/2023 10:52, Chris Woolf via Tech1 wrote: >> You are so right - trying to unravel the staggeringly complicated pension rules is all but impossible for most people. >> Cards on table - no point in being coy. The government pension for me has just been put up to give ?421 /week. I'm 75, and have paid NI for all the years I worked. I also did the SERPS thing - there wasn't a lot of choice when they started it up with various bribes. Since I've been a freelance most of my working life I also made small (?50/month) private contributions, and added in the odd extra lump sum when possible. >> I was still finding work through my company when I reached 65 (my retirement age) and so deferred my pension. At 10.25% / annum increase that was a massive benefit, and I only put the lid on that a couple of years ago when it looked as if the chancellor might axe that lucrative scheme. >> I had to take my private pension last year since I wasn't allowed to keep it past 75. Wanted to invest it in a rental property for a friend, but sadly you can't do that - the restrictions on using "your" money are ludicrous. The system is rigged so that the insurance and banking companies make the most out of your money. >> When my first wife died (2009) I needed to sell my house - didn't like living in it any longer - so I sold it to some friends. They couldn't afford a sensible price so I gave them a private mortgage for half of it. Thus I get a respectable income from that too - it forms a useful chunk of "pension". >> And my business still provides a comfortable income currently, though I cannot tell how much longer that will continue. Together with putting spare capital into the renovation of my current house, as much to make it long-term inexpensive to run as anything else, income, expenditure and tax outgoings all balance up tolerably well ... at the moment. >> Largely by chance - certainly not long-term planning - I've ended up with an acceptable income which means I don't have to watch every penny, thank goodness. >> But if you asked a pension advisor about any of that lot you would get some weird looks. >> Chris Woolf >>> On 12/04/2023 20:10, Paul Thackray via Tech1 wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> I am sure I will get shot down in flames for saying this, but in lots of cases it's very difficult to work out who is winning and who is losing in the different State Pension versions. A straight old pension v new pension is not comparing like for like in any way. Its extremely dependent on your work history, sex and a few ?strange? edge cases as the system was changed at various dates. >>> >>> Looking at a few examples. >>> >>> Someone now in their 80?s, who worked as a staff member, but did not have a company pension or and was not contracted out would get Old State Pension + Full SERPS / Second Pension. The Old Pension has gone up using the Triple lock (Like the New) but the Second Pension / SERPS has only gone up by CPI (Maybe 1% is the Triple lock-CPI on ? of the pension) So 0.25%(?) behind those on a new pension. It looks like they are losing, except if you compare someone at the age of 80 today, they have been paid the state pension for 15 years or 20 years (Depending if they are a Man or a Woman) Compare that with anyone who is 60 today, will only get paid 13 years of payments at the new rate. (And likely had to contribute for 5-7 more years of working life) By the time they reach 80. >>> In this comparison those on the Old + SERPS are defiantly not losers in comparison with people who have yet to retire at 67. >>> >>> >>> If you were staff & had a works pension, you were likely contracted out, paying less in to the state system (as it was diverted to a Company pension, you should be benefiting from) Hence its only fair as you paid less in, you get less out of the state system. >>> >>> >>> For Freelancers, you were not allowed to pay in to the State Second Pension. You paid lower contributions and were supposed to invest this in a private pension. It would be unfair for those who paid lower contributions to get the same as those that paid in full. (If you did not invest it, then that was a choice you made then that you might be regretting now, but it was a choice. ? sorry if this seam harsh, but it?s is fair?) >>> >>> >>> The Government talk of the Old & New pension is not helpful. It's really all smoke and mirrors. Quite a few on the ?New Pension ? do not get the quoted figure. >>> You only get the full amount if you were never Freelance before 2016, Never Contracted out and have 35 years of full contributions. >>> >>> To give my example, I have 46 years of NI contributions, but will not get a Full New State Pension (At 67) unless I get another year on my NI Records before I get to 67. Its all a very unfair system (?) Some years I have paid ?0 , this counted as ?a year? some years I paid around ?3,900 this also counted as ?a year? towards my 35 I need (Which is actually 47 needed?.) >>> >>> (This may cause some discussion....) >>> Paul >>> >>> Paul Thackray >>> PGT Media Consulting Ltd. >>> 07802 243979 >>> Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk >>> Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk >>> Linkedin;?? http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 >>> IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Tech1 On Behalf Of B Wilkinson via Tech1 >>> Sent: 08 April 2023 13:42 >>> To: tech1 >>> Subject: [Tech1] Time for a moan!( I hope I am sending this to the correct group) >>> >>> I keep reading in the Press how the State Pension has risen due to the triple lock. They don?t even call it the New State Pension any more . Those of us who? started taking our pensions pre 2016 are on a considerably lower payout than post 2016 pensioners as many of you will know. So the cumulative effect of percentage rises for us old crusties compared with the New Pensioners is that we get further and further behind in cash terms . It?s about time this was put right as New Pensioners didn?t have to contribute over the years as much as Old Pensioners. >>> So every time the government and the press say how generous the increase in pensions is this year I get very annoyed and need to vent my anger. >>> The problem is there is nobody to complain to. The government don?t care as it saves them money and there doesn?t seem to be any group trying to put things right. >>> Mr Angry >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> > > -- > Dave Plowman > London, SW > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From alec.bray.2 at gmail.com Sat Apr 15 09:15:11 2023 From: alec.bray.2 at gmail.com (Alec Bray) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2023 15:15:11 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting Message-ID: Hi all, I know some of you like steam locomotives. Some of you like films. Some of you like history (and historical research) Some of you like technology - and historical technology... I hope that you might enjoy the attached - about the filming of "The Titfield Thunderbolt" - some of you have contributed stories about this to the Tech Ops web site - Thank you! This has been written for the Reading Society of Model Engineers internal newsletter (limited circulation). Any errors, please let me know!!! very best regards, Alec -- ======= Alec Bray alec.bray.2 at gmail.com Mob: 07789 561 346 Tel: 0118 981 7502 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Thunderbolt and Lighting.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 2473340 bytes Desc: not available URL: From graeme.wall at icloud.com Sat Apr 15 09:36:08 2023 From: graeme.wall at icloud.com (Graeme Wall) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2023 15:36:08 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2CE40F12-C362-4E1B-982B-E25D24242607@icloud.com> Many thanks Alec. Lovely stuff. I remember going to see the film around 1954 in Feltham and, like you, going to see Lion at Didcot, unfortunately I don?t have any photos from that occasion. My grandchildren love the film, I often get asked to let them watch it when they come to visit. Just one thing, I always understood the mock-up 14XX was built round a Landrover. NB there?s one typo, just after the photo showing the lorry driver you?ve got ?two of the local, drunken, *villages* steal a steam engine. > On 15 Apr 2023, at 15:15, Alec Bray via Tech1 wrote: > > Hi all, > > I know some of you like steam locomotives. > Some of you like films. > Some of you like history (and historical research) > Some of you like technology - and historical technology... > > I hope that you might enjoy the attached - about the filming of "The Titfield Thunderbolt" - some of you have contributed stories about this to the Tech Ops web site - Thank you! > This has been written for the Reading Society of Model Engineers internal newsletter (limited circulation). > > Any errors, please let me know!!! > > very best regards, > > Alec > -- > ======= > > Alec Bray > > alec.bray.2 at gmail.com > Mob: 07789 561 346 > Tel: 0118 981 7502 > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk ? Graeme Wall From alec.bray.2 at gmail.com Sat Apr 15 10:30:36 2023 From: alec.bray.2 at gmail.com (Alec Bray) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2023 16:30:36 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting In-Reply-To: <2CE40F12-C362-4E1B-982B-E25D24242607@icloud.com> References: <2CE40F12-C362-4E1B-982B-E25D24242607@icloud.com> Message-ID: Hi Graeme, Thank you for your comments - and thank you very much for your corrections! I must say that a Land-rover of the time seems a very good candidate for the 14xx mock up! Best regards Alec Sent from my mobile phone. Apologies for any strange autocorrections... On Sat, 15 Apr 2023, 15:36 Graeme Wall, wrote: > Many thanks Alec. > > Lovely stuff. I remember going to see the film around 1954 in Feltham and, > like you, going to see Lion at Didcot, unfortunately I don?t have any > photos from that occasion. > > My grandchildren love the film, I often get asked to let them watch it > when they come to visit. > > Just one thing, I always understood the mock-up 14XX was built round a > Landrover. > > NB there?s one typo, just after the photo showing the lorry driver you?ve > got ?two of the local, drunken, *villages* steal a steam engine. > > > On 15 Apr 2023, at 15:15, Alec Bray via Tech1 > wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > > > I know some of you like steam locomotives. > > Some of you like films. > > Some of you like history (and historical research) > > Some of you like technology - and historical technology... > > > > I hope that you might enjoy the attached - about the filming of "The > Titfield Thunderbolt" - some of you have contributed stories about this to > the Tech Ops web site - Thank you! > > This has been written for the Reading Society of Model Engineers > internal newsletter (limited circulation). > > > > Any errors, please let me know!!! > > > > very best regards, > > > > Alec > > -- > > ======= > > > > Alec Bray > > > > alec.bray.2 at gmail.com > > Mob: 07789 561 346 > > Tel: 0118 981 7502 > > -- > > Tech1 mailing list > > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > > ? > Graeme Wall > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alec.bray.2 at gmail.com Sat Apr 15 13:24:29 2023 From: alec.bray.2 at gmail.com (Alec Bray) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2023 19:24:29 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Dave, Thank you for your email! Yes, Simon's book - and other sources - are very clear about the origins of the story of The Titfield Thunderbolt. I did not include it as I was trying to keep the word count down - it will probably be published in several parts in our "Prospectus" as it is (and with far fewer pictures) - and the RSME audience would probably be more interested in the loco and the Techicolor process. Thank you for pointing out the Talyllyn Railway was the inspiration for the others here! Very best regards, Alec Sent from my mobile phone. Apologies for any strange autocorrections... On Sat, 15 Apr 2023, 18:41 Dave Buckley, wrote: > Hi Alec, > > Many thanks for posting your item about the film, The Titfield Thunderbolt. > > Like a lot of members on in this group, this is a film I enjoy any time > it comes on TV. > > I note that one of the references given for your article, is Simon > Castens book 'On the trail of the Titfield Thunderbolt', a book I > purchased straight away when it was published. I was a bit surprised > that there was no mention though, that the storyline of the film was > inspired by the early days of the preservation of the Talyllyn Railway > in North Wales, although this is mentioned at the start of Simon's book. > In fact at least on of the incidents in the film (where the water supply > is sabotaged) is based on an actual situation on the TR, although the > water tower wasn't shot at! > > There's another book about the film - The Titfield Thunderbolt, Now and > Then - by Oliver Fosker, which goes through the film showing scenes from > the film with photos showing the locations now. > > At one time, the engine used - Lion - was the oldest engine allowed to > run on BR rails, and I had a railway book some time ago, with a photo > showing Lion out on the main line, passing a colour light signal! I > think it was something to do with the celebrations at Shildon in 1975. > > For a bit of nostalgia, have a look at... > > https://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/shildon_rail_150_celebrations/zjkmwnb > > Regards, > > Dave Buckley > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From graeme.wall at icloud.com Sat Apr 15 13:39:48 2023 From: graeme.wall at icloud.com (Graeme Wall) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2023 19:39:48 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Lion wan?t at Shildon, she made an appearance at Rainhill a few years later for the Liverpool & Manchetser celebrations. I was at Shildon, working with the GWS sales team, we took our own bookshop! Got a perfect position to watch the cavalcade on the big day. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Locomotion No 1 at Shildon.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 701183 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > On 15 Apr 2023, at 19:24, Alec Bray via Tech1 wrote: > > Hi Dave, > > Thank you for your email! > > Yes, Simon's book - and other sources - are very clear about the origins of the story of The Titfield Thunderbolt. I did not include it as I was trying to keep the word count down - it will probably be published in several parts in our "Prospectus" as it is (and with far fewer pictures) - and the RSME audience would probably be more interested in the loco and the Techicolor process. > > Thank you for pointing out the Talyllyn Railway was the inspiration for the others here! > > Very best regards, Alec > > > > Sent from my mobile phone. Apologies for any strange autocorrections... > > On Sat, 15 Apr 2023, 18:41 Dave Buckley, wrote: > Hi Alec, > > Many thanks for posting your item about the film, The Titfield Thunderbolt. > > Like a lot of members on in this group, this is a film I enjoy any time > it comes on TV. > > I note that one of the references given for your article, is Simon > Castens book 'On the trail of the Titfield Thunderbolt', a book I > purchased straight away when it was published. I was a bit surprised > that there was no mention though, that the storyline of the film was > inspired by the early days of the preservation of the Talyllyn Railway > in North Wales, although this is mentioned at the start of Simon's book. > In fact at least on of the incidents in the film (where the water supply > is sabotaged) is based on an actual situation on the TR, although the > water tower wasn't shot at! > > There's another book about the film - The Titfield Thunderbolt, Now and > Then - by Oliver Fosker, which goes through the film showing scenes from > the film with photos showing the locations now. > > At one time, the engine used - Lion - was the oldest engine allowed to > run on BR rails, and I had a railway book some time ago, with a photo > showing Lion out on the main line, passing a colour light signal! I > think it was something to do with the celebrations at Shildon in 1975. > > For a bit of nostalgia, have a look at... > > https://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/shildon_rail_150_celebrations/zjkmwnb > > Regards, > > Dave Buckley > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk ? Graeme Wall From mikej at bmanor.co.uk Sun Apr 16 04:03:23 2023 From: mikej at bmanor.co.uk (Mike Jordan) Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2023 10:03:23 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Bettany Hughes programme audio Message-ID: <9858CDEE26FD41F48328074D21760D1F@Gigabyte> Hi folks ? a query from a mere OB Comms person! I have been watching with interest her recent series about all sorts of middle eastern places. I was continuously amazed with the audio quality of her speech absolutely everywhere. No sign of a radio mic and using a boom or rifle must have been impossible at some locations in the middle of nowhere or surrounded by people and street noises. How on earth did they mic it? She is a great person, I once had to do an interview at her house here in Ealing for a local pressure group meeting. Of course she was instantly understanding of the technicalities and we did it all OK with a carefully re-positioned couple of desk lamps. I wonder if I ever kept a copy? Must look. My pre-BBC experiences ran to doing the PA for all sorts of events at school, stage fx, editing video and audio for a school copy version of?IF? movie on 16mm/tape and best of all recording Paul Simon LIVE for our folk club. And not forgetting house Christmas stage party show lit with light bulbs in the base of 7lb marmalade tins from the canteen rubbish tip! All good fun and good experience. As I always say, mending the 16mm film for projecting to the school with liquid film cement was a truly enticing smell and made one quite ?happy? Mike -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jnottage.jn at googlemail.com Sun Apr 16 04:13:04 2023 From: jnottage.jn at googlemail.com (John Nottage) Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2023 10:13:04 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Bettany Hughes programme audio In-Reply-To: <9858CDEE26FD41F48328074D21760D1F@Gigabyte> References: <9858CDEE26FD41F48328074D21760D1F@Gigabyte> Message-ID: <50218597-f96a-328a-594e-830b73e7b61b@googlemail.com> Many, many years ago I did a gig from John Dankworth's place in Wavenden. The director didn't want to see any mics. Cleo Lane was a well built lady & the mic was tucked out sight between her breasts, no clip needed - very discrete & fine quality. Bettany Hughes is similarly built. Maybe that's where they put her mic. I agree - excellent series: she got to so many amazing places I'd never heard of. John Nottage On 16/04/2023 10:03, Mike Jordan via Tech1 wrote: > Hi folks ? a query from a mere OB Comms person! > I have been watching with interest her recent series about all sorts of > middle eastern places. > I was continuously amazed with the audio quality of her speech > absolutely everywhere. > No sign of a radio mic and using a boom or rifle must have been > impossible at some locations in the middle of nowhere or surrounded by > people and street noises. > How on earth did they mic it? > She is a great person, I once had to do an interview at her house here > in Ealing for a local pressure group meeting. Of course she was > instantly understanding of the technicalities and we did it all OK with > a carefully re-positioned couple of desk lamps. I wonder if I ever kept > a copy? Must look. > My pre-BBC experiences ran to doing the PA for all sorts of events at > school, stage fx, editing video and audio for a school copy version > of?IF? movie on 16mm/tape and best of all recording Paul Simon LIVE for > our folk club. And not forgetting house Christmas stage party show lit > with light bulbs in the base of 7lb marmalade tins from the canteen > rubbish tip! > All good fun and good experience. As I always say, mending the 16mm film > for projecting to the school with liquid film cement was a truly > enticing smell and made one quite ?happy? > Mike > From alanaudio at me.com Sun Apr 16 04:56:38 2023 From: alanaudio at me.com (Alan Taylor) Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2023 10:56:38 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Bettany Hughes programme audio In-Reply-To: <50218597-f96a-328a-594e-830b73e7b61b@googlemail.com> References: <50218597-f96a-328a-594e-830b73e7b61b@googlemail.com> Message-ID: I couldn?t help but notice that on one of those rare occasions when somebody praises the sound quality, the programme credits include a sound recordist. One might wonder if those two observations might be linked in any way? I?m pretty sure she would have been recorded via personal mics. The microphones themselves can be very inconspicuous these days and the Tx packs are getting smaller and easier to conceal. Some of them also record the audio digitally so that there is no risk of reception problems. I?ve done shows where the presenter has worn two independent personal mics. If one is affected by clothing rustle or wind noise, the other might be OK at that instant. Even if it records within the device, you do still need to record the two mics independently so that you can instantly play it back to check that when a problem is found on one mic, the other is clear at that moment and you immediately know there is no need for a retake. Bettany often wears thin, flowing scarves which can be useful for concealing mics. She might be amenable to having a microphone in her hairline, that can work well and as John has observed, her bosom is microphone friendly too. I too worked on those shows with John & Cleo in their home. Graham Haines was mixing them and Graham and I chatted about those shows when we last spoke. What John said about Cleo?s cleavage microphone is entirely true, but there is a little more to the story as well. One morning, Cleo was being a bit reluctant to come downstairs and start rehearsal. John was getting a little impatient with her because she is not normally like that. He asked if he could put her microphone in the freezer. It was an ECM50, which is quite large compared to modern personal mics and has a lot of metal parts. His idea was that the longer she took, the colder the mic would get and the more uncomfortable it was going to feel slipping the mic and connector down her d?colletage. They were fabulous shows to work on and after the recording, the crew were welcome to delay their journey home and stay on to enjoy improvised performances by John, Cleo and the guests from that day. Alan > On 16 Apr 2023, at 10:13, John Nottage via Tech1 wrote: > > ?Many, many years ago I did a gig from John Dankworth's place in Wavenden. The director didn't want to see any mics. Cleo Lane was a well built lady & the mic was tucked out sight between her breasts, no clip needed - very discrete & fine quality. Bettany Hughes is similarly built. Maybe that's where they put her mic. > I agree - excellent series: she got to so many amazing places I'd never heard of. > > John Nottage > >> On 16/04/2023 10:03, Mike Jordan via Tech1 wrote: >> Hi folks ? a query from a mere OB Comms person! >> I have been watching with interest her recent series about all sorts of middle eastern places. >> I was continuously amazed with the audio quality of her speech absolutely everywhere. >> No sign of a radio mic and using a boom or rifle must have been impossible at some locations in the middle of nowhere or surrounded by people and street noises. >> How on earth did they mic it? >> She is a great person, I once had to do an interview at her house here in Ealing for a local pressure group meeting. Of course she was instantly understanding of the technicalities and we did it all OK with a carefully re-positioned couple of desk lamps. I wonder if I ever kept a copy? Must look. >> My pre-BBC experiences ran to doing the PA for all sorts of events at school, stage fx, editing video and audio for a school copy version of?IF? movie on 16mm/tape and best of all recording Paul Simon LIVE for our folk club. And not forgetting house Christmas stage party show lit with light bulbs in the base of 7lb marmalade tins from the canteen rubbish tip! >> All good fun and good experience. As I always say, mending the 16mm film for projecting to the school with liquid film cement was a truly enticing smell and made one quite ?happy? >> Mike > > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From mikej at bmanor.co.uk Sun Apr 16 05:19:28 2023 From: mikej at bmanor.co.uk (Mike Jordan) Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2023 11:19:28 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Bettany Hughes programme audio In-Reply-To: <50218597-f96a-328a-594e-830b73e7b61b@googlemail.com> References: <9858CDEE26FD41F48328074D21760D1F@Gigabyte> <50218597-f96a-328a-594e-830b73e7b61b@googlemail.com> Message-ID: That trick can be difficult for male presenters (inc Monty Don) and sports personalities who wear tightish shirts and, despite presumably receiving reasonable salaries, can't afford to have surgery on the huge boils that are in the centre of their chests and show as a large bump through the clothes! Another sad story from me was of going to a show at my old school a while ago and noted that the very clever black student singer and dancer had been fitted with a mic micropore taped to forehead - good if much costume movement etc - and cabled over his head and down his back to the Tx. Unfortunately they only had PINK cabled mics which went right over his hair! At least Antiques Roadshow now have some white fluffy windshields to go on guests with light coloured clothes. Mike -----Original Message----- From: John Nottage via Tech1 Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2023 10:13 AM To: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk Subject: Re: [Tech1] Bettany Hughes programme audio Many, many years ago I did a gig from John Dankworth's place in Wavenden. The director didn't want to see any mics. Cleo Lane was a well built lady & the mic was tucked out sight between her breasts, no clip needed - very discrete & fine quality. Bettany Hughes is similarly built. Maybe that's where they put her mic. I agree - excellent series: she got to so many amazing places I'd never heard of. John Nottage From dnewbitt at fireflyuk.net Sun Apr 16 06:33:45 2023 From: dnewbitt at fireflyuk.net (David Newbitt) Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2023 12:33:45 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Bettany Hughes programme audio In-Reply-To: References: <9858CDEE26FD41F48328074D21760D1F@Gigabyte><50218597-f96a-328a-594e-830b73e7b61b@googlemail.com> Message-ID: <5097FC2239CF4930B2BB9F8D00CEBCC7@DESKTOP6GGCRV1> As you both remark, an excellent series all round. I don't much care for travel programmes as a rule largely because watching presenters having a whale of a time probably doesn't much reflect what the average holidaymaker can expect. Huge exceptions of course such as Michael Palin in Patagonia and now this. I was bowled over and if I thought my legs were up to it I'd be seriously looking at ways of getting to Albania as a starter. Dave Newbitt. -----Original Message----- From: Mike Jordan via Tech1 Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2023 11:19 AM To: John Nottage ; tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk Subject: Re: [Tech1] Bettany Hughes programme audio That trick can be difficult for male presenters (inc Monty Don) and sports personalities who wear tightish shirts and, despite presumably receiving reasonable salaries, can't afford to have surgery on the huge boils that are in the centre of their chests and show as a large bump through the clothes! Another sad story from me was of going to a show at my old school a while ago and noted that the very clever black student singer and dancer had been fitted with a mic micropore taped to forehead - good if much costume movement etc - and cabled over his head and down his back to the Tx. Unfortunately they only had PINK cabled mics which went right over his hair! At least Antiques Roadshow now have some white fluffy windshields to go on guests with light coloured clothes. Mike -----Original Message----- From: John Nottage via Tech1 Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2023 10:13 AM To: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk Subject: Re: [Tech1] Bettany Hughes programme audio Many, many years ago I did a gig from John Dankworth's place in Wavenden. The director didn't want to see any mics. Cleo Lane was a well built lady & the mic was tucked out sight between her breasts, no clip needed - very discrete & fine quality. Bettany Hughes is similarly built. Maybe that's where they put her mic. I agree - excellent series: she got to so many amazing places I'd never heard of. John Nottage -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From hughsheppard at btinternet.com Sun Apr 16 06:56:35 2023 From: hughsheppard at btinternet.com (Hugh Sheppard) Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2023 12:56:35 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Bettany Hughes programme audio In-Reply-To: References: <9858CDEE26FD41F48328074D21760D1F@Gigabyte> <50218597-f96a-328a-594e-830b73e7b61b@googlemail.com> Message-ID: As well as representing a welcome reason to watch more of Bettany Hughes, Mike Jordan's missives raise a couple of unrelated questions: * The enlightenment about such an extraordinary place as Azerbaijan baulked at any mention of its authoritarian regimen; wouldn't a hint have been appropriate? * I am utterly fed-up with match commentaries (not usually BBC) where audibility is so often compromised by too much crowd noise overwhelming the voice, either via the commentary mic or/and an auto-mixer set to fill any pauses with noise.? How much of that is due to cheek mics and commentator vanity?? Is there yet anything better than the L2 Lip-mic for noise-cancelling, designed 70 years ago? Best Hugh Sheppard On 16/04/2023 11:19, Mike Jordan via Tech1 wrote: > That trick can be difficult for male presenters (inc Monty Don) and > sports personalities who wear tightish? shirts and, despite presumably > receiving reasonable salaries, can't afford to have surgery on the > huge boils that are in the centre of their chests and show as a large > bump through the clothes! > > Another sad story from me was of going to a show at my old school a > while ago and noted that the very clever black student singer and > dancer had been fitted with a mic micropore taped to forehead - good > if much costume movement etc - and cabled over his head and down his > back to the Tx. Unfortunately they only had PINK cabled mics which > went right over his hair! > At least Antiques Roadshow now have some white fluffy windshields to > go on guests with light coloured clothes. > > Mike > > -----Original Message----- From: John Nottage via Tech1 > Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2023 10:13 AM > To: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > Subject: Re: [Tech1] Bettany Hughes programme audio > > Many, many years ago I did a gig from John Dankworth's place in > Wavenden. The director didn't want to see any? mics. Cleo Lane was a > well built lady & the mic was tucked out sight between her breasts, no > clip needed - very discrete & fine quality. Bettany Hughes is similarly > built. Maybe that's where they put her mic. > I agree - excellent series: she got to so many amazing places I'd never > heard of. > > John Nottage > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From plowmandave44 at gmail.com Sun Apr 16 07:51:04 2023 From: plowmandave44 at gmail.com (Dave Plowman) Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2023 13:51:04 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Bettany Hughes programme audio In-Reply-To: <50218597-f96a-328a-594e-830b73e7b61b@googlemail.com> References: <9858CDEE26FD41F48328074D21760D1F@Gigabyte> <50218597-f96a-328a-594e-830b73e7b61b@googlemail.com> Message-ID: <171c11d3-e23b-7ce6-198b-c3a33ccc02c6@gmail.com> Very very rare for any mic worn on the chest to produce 'fine quality'. And not usual for a director to be more interested in pictures than sound. Remember ages ago working on the studio end of an Olympics. All the discussions etc on personals, obviously. After each prog we did a trail for the next one. So I did that one man to camera using a tight desk mic. And got a query from VT about 'poor sound' Think that VT man in now in charge everywhere. On 16/04/2023 10:13, John Nottage via Tech1 wrote: > Many, many years ago I did a gig from John Dankworth's place in > Wavenden. The director didn't want to see any? mics. Cleo Lane was a > well built lady & the mic was tucked out sight between her breasts, no > clip needed - very discrete & fine quality. Bettany Hughes is similarly > built. Maybe that's where they put her mic. > I agree - excellent series: she got to so many amazing places I'd never > heard of. > > John Nottage > > On 16/04/2023 10:03, Mike Jordan via Tech1 wrote: >> Hi folks ? a query from a mere OB Comms person! >> I have been watching with interest her recent series about all sorts >> of middle eastern places. >> I was continuously amazed with the audio quality of her speech >> absolutely everywhere. >> No sign of a radio mic and using a boom or rifle must have been >> impossible at some locations in the middle of nowhere or surrounded by >> people and street noises. >> How on earth did they mic it? >> She is a great person, I once had to do an interview at her house here >> in Ealing for a local pressure group meeting. Of course she was >> instantly understanding of the technicalities and we did it all OK >> with a carefully re-positioned couple of desk lamps. I wonder if I >> ever kept a copy? Must look. >> My pre-BBC experiences ran to doing the PA for all sorts of events at >> school, stage fx, editing video and audio for a school copy version >> of?IF? movie on 16mm/tape and best of all recording Paul Simon LIVE >> for our folk club. And not forgetting house Christmas stage party show >> lit with light bulbs in the base of 7lb marmalade tins from the >> canteen rubbish tip! >> All good fun and good experience. As I always say, mending the 16mm >> film for projecting to the school with liquid film cement was a truly >> enticing smell and made one quite ?happy? >> Mike >> > > -- Dave Plowman London, SW From pat.heigham at amps.net Sun Apr 16 11:47:37 2023 From: pat.heigham at amps.net (Pat Heigham) Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2023 17:47:37 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Steam Trains In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Certainly, for me! For my 80th Birthday celebration, I privately chartered the beautifully restored Golden Arrow Pullman train operated by the Bluebell Railway in Sussex. This was for a dinner party in a moving dining room! Steam hauled of course. And at night to pretend we were on the Orient Express, all guests were in evening dress, and my gang of friends chipped in to pay for a personalised headboard for the locomotive. I make no apology for the pun! A few photos attached. Pat On 15/04/2023 15:15, Alec Bray via Tech1 wrote: > > Hi all, > I know some of you like steam locomotives. > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Golden Arrow train.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 1759423 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Pullman.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 63712 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Engine + Board 2.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 306965 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Boarding Golden Arrow.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 1840293 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Pat+Board+Driver.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 406008 bytes Desc: not available URL: From dnewbitt at fireflyuk.net Sun Apr 16 12:14:48 2023 From: dnewbitt at fireflyuk.net (David Newbitt) Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2023 18:14:48 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Absolutely fascinating read Alec - I greatly enjoyed it and marvelled at the prodigious amount of effort that went into the film. As to the film technology employed I find it jaw-dropping; getting results in those days was hard graft indeed. A wonderful compilation. Dave Newbitt. -----Original Message----- From: Graeme Wall via Tech1 Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2023 7:39 PM To: Alec Bray Cc: Tech ops Subject: Re: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting Lion wan?t at Shildon, she made an appearance at Rainhill a few years later for the Liverpool & Manchetser celebrations. I was at Shildon, working with the GWS sales team, we took our own bookshop! Got a perfect position to watch the cavalcade on the big day. > On 15 Apr 2023, at 19:24, Alec Bray via Tech1 > wrote: > > Hi Dave, > > Thank you for your email! > > Yes, Simon's book - and other sources - are very clear about the origins > of the story of The Titfield Thunderbolt. I did not include it as I was > trying to keep the word count down - it will probably be published in > several parts in our "Prospectus" as it is (and with far fewer pictures) - > and the RSME audience would probably be more interested in the loco and > the Techicolor process. > > Thank you for pointing out the Talyllyn Railway was the inspiration for > the others here! > > Very best regards, Alec > > > > Sent from my mobile phone. Apologies for any strange autocorrections... > > On Sat, 15 Apr 2023, 18:41 Dave Buckley, wrote: > Hi Alec, > > Many thanks for posting your item about the film, The Titfield > Thunderbolt. > > Like a lot of members on in this group, this is a film I enjoy any time > it comes on TV. > > I note that one of the references given for your article, is Simon > Castens book 'On the trail of the Titfield Thunderbolt', a book I > purchased straight away when it was published. I was a bit surprised > that there was no mention though, that the storyline of the film was > inspired by the early days of the preservation of the Talyllyn Railway > in North Wales, although this is mentioned at the start of Simon's book. > In fact at least on of the incidents in the film (where the water supply > is sabotaged) is based on an actual situation on the TR, although the > water tower wasn't shot at! > > There's another book about the film - The Titfield Thunderbolt, Now and > Then - by Oliver Fosker, which goes through the film showing scenes from > the film with photos showing the locations now. > > At one time, the engine used - Lion - was the oldest engine allowed to > run on BR rails, and I had a railway book some time ago, with a photo > showing Lion out on the main line, passing a colour light signal! I > think it was something to do with the celebrations at Shildon in 1975. > > For a bit of nostalgia, have a look at... > > https://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/shildon_rail_150_celebrations/zjkmwnb > > Regards, > > Dave Buckley > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk ? Graeme Wall -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From dnewbitt at fireflyuk.net Mon Apr 17 03:47:35 2023 From: dnewbitt at fireflyuk.net (David Newbitt) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2023 09:47:35 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] News presenter redundancies Message-ID: <1856DD731D8647208B8AF43DD69364ED@DESKTOP6GGCRV1> I?m not sure I buy the construction BBC News are now putting on the reasoning behind voluntary redundancy letters apparently sent to Huw Edwards, Sophie Raworth, Rita Chakrabati and Clive Myrie. They seem clear about the motive being reduction of costs but ally this to a claim that the letters are exploratory and in line with normal exercises adopted at such times with no compulsion nor threat of it. If none of these senior figures go for the voluntary package then presumably no money is saved. So where then? Maybe offers to continue in their roles at much reduced remuneration with rejection leading to forced redundancies? I can see like everyone else that the well established shortage of finance has already seen negative impact on the BBC?s output and services and as this ramps up, decisions about ?cutting one?s cloth? will become ever more difficult and inevitably more damaging. I?m sure on this forum there are those with far greater insight and wonder if anyone can see a path to a successful future for the Beeb? Dave Newbitt. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From peter.neill at icloud.com Mon Apr 17 03:51:17 2023 From: peter.neill at icloud.com (Peter Neill) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2023 09:51:17 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] News presenter redundancies In-Reply-To: <1856DD731D8647208B8AF43DD69364ED@DESKTOP6GGCRV1> References: <1856DD731D8647208B8AF43DD69364ED@DESKTOP6GGCRV1> Message-ID: <0CA5D949-3967-41CB-88EF-27559C664374@icloud.com> As I understand it this was simply an ?all staff? exercise which is normal with trawls for redundancy Also I believe Huw is on contract (which has recently been renewed) anyway. Sent from my iPhone. Apologies for typos and autocorruptions. > On 17 Apr 2023, at 09:48, David Newbitt via Tech1 wrote: > > ? > I?m not sure I buy the construction BBC News are now putting on the reasoning behind voluntary redundancy letters apparently sent to Huw Edwards, Sophie Raworth, Rita Chakrabati and Clive Myrie. They seem clear about the motive being reduction of costs but ally this to a claim that the letters are exploratory and in line with normal exercises adopted at such times with no compulsion nor threat of it. > > If none of these senior figures go for the voluntary package then presumably no money is saved. So where then? Maybe offers to continue in their roles at much reduced remuneration with rejection leading to forced redundancies? > > I can see like everyone else that the well established shortage of finance has already seen negative impact on the BBC?s output and services and as this ramps up, decisions about ?cutting one?s cloth? will become ever more difficult and inevitably more damaging. > > I?m sure on this forum there are those with far greater insight and wonder if anyone can see a path to a successful future for the Beeb? > > Dave Newbitt. > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From plowmandave44 at gmail.com Mon Apr 17 03:57:02 2023 From: plowmandave44 at gmail.com (Dave Plowman) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2023 09:57:02 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] News presenter redundancies In-Reply-To: <1856DD731D8647208B8AF43DD69364ED@DESKTOP6GGCRV1> References: <1856DD731D8647208B8AF43DD69364ED@DESKTOP6GGCRV1> Message-ID: <79561912-a477-5dd9-0b1f-47f92f299f52@gmail.com> Seems to me most who want rid of the licence are those who don't want to pay it, rather than those who can't afford to. No different to the NHS, etc. On 17/04/2023 09:47, David Newbitt via Tech1 wrote: > I?m not sure I buy the construction BBC News are now putting on the > reasoning behind voluntary redundancy letters apparently sent to Huw > Edwards, Sophie Raworth, Rita Chakrabati and Clive Myrie. They seem > clear about the motive being reduction of costs but ally this to a claim > that the letters are exploratory and in line with normal exercises > adopted at such times with no compulsion nor threat of it. > If none of these senior figures go for the voluntary package then > presumably no money is saved. So where then? Maybe offers to continue in > their roles at much reduced remuneration with rejection leading to > forced redundancies? > I can see like everyone else that the well established shortage of > finance has already seen negative impact on the BBC?s output and > services and as this ramps up, decisions about ?cutting one?s cloth? > will become ever more difficult and inevitably more damaging. > I?m sure on this forum there are those with far greater insight and > wonder if anyone can see a path to a successful future for the Beeb? > Dave Newbitt. > -- Dave Plowman London, SW From dnewbitt at fireflyuk.net Mon Apr 17 04:06:21 2023 From: dnewbitt at fireflyuk.net (David Newbitt) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2023 10:06:21 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] News presenter redundancies In-Reply-To: <0CA5D949-3967-41CB-88EF-27559C664374@icloud.com> References: <1856DD731D8647208B8AF43DD69364ED@DESKTOP6GGCRV1> <0CA5D949-3967-41CB-88EF-27559C664374@icloud.com> Message-ID: <3C3E5BA5D4D346A7887301FC2592EF5D@DESKTOP6GGCRV1> Indeed Peter ? as I said in my moan ?...in line with normal exercises...?. However, off the back of recent terminations involving a number of other highly competent, high profile figures I find the bland reassurance less than compelling. Dave Newbitt. From: Peter Neill Sent: Monday, April 17, 2023 9:51 AM To: David Newbitt Cc: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk Subject: Re: [Tech1] News presenter redundancies As I understand it this was simply an ?all staff? exercise which is normal with trawls for redundancy Also I believe Huw is on contract (which has recently been renewed) anyway. Sent from my iPhone. Apologies for typos and autocorruptions. On 17 Apr 2023, at 09:48, David Newbitt via Tech1 wrote: ? I?m not sure I buy the construction BBC News are now putting on the reasoning behind voluntary redundancy letters apparently sent to Huw Edwards, Sophie Raworth, Rita Chakrabati and Clive Myrie. They seem clear about the motive being reduction of costs but ally this to a claim that the letters are exploratory and in line with normal exercises adopted at such times with no compulsion nor threat of it. If none of these senior figures go for the voluntary package then presumably no money is saved. So where then? Maybe offers to continue in their roles at much reduced remuneration with rejection leading to forced redundancies? I can see like everyone else that the well established shortage of finance has already seen negative impact on the BBC?s output and services and as this ramps up, decisions about ?cutting one?s cloth? will become ever more difficult and inevitably more damaging. I?m sure on this forum there are those with far greater insight and wonder if anyone can see a path to a successful future for the Beeb? Dave Newbitt. -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From doug at puddifoot.me Mon Apr 17 11:30:22 2023 From: doug at puddifoot.me (Doug Puddifoot) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2023 17:30:22 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Tea Message-ID: <6BEA4C3DBF544B4985D6FEA125999828@NewOffice> Well if this is true Tony must be immortal! Doug Puddifoot -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Tea.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 628389 bytes Desc: not available URL: From alanaudio at me.com Mon Apr 17 12:39:23 2023 From: alanaudio at me.com (Alan Taylor) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2023 18:39:23 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Tea In-Reply-To: <6BEA4C3DBF544B4985D6FEA125999828@NewOffice> References: <6BEA4C3DBF544B4985D6FEA125999828@NewOffice> Message-ID: If you dunk Hobnobs into your tea, you also get the health benefits of extra fibre in your diet. Chocolate is made from beans, therefore chocolate coated Hobnobs not only give you added fibre, but must count as one of your five per day. I?m surprised that chocolate Hobnobs dunked in a mug of tea aren?t universally recognised as being a superfood. Cheers Alan > On 17 Apr 2023, at 17:31, Doug Puddifoot via Tech1 wrote: > > ? > Well if this is true Tony must be immortal! > > Doug Puddifoot > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Tea.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 27449 bytes Desc: not available URL: From peter.fox at zero51.force9.co.uk Mon Apr 17 15:29:06 2023 From: peter.fox at zero51.force9.co.uk (Peter Fox) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2023 21:29:06 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Tea In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Pity about the sugar. That cancels it all out Peter Fox On 17 Apr 2023, at 18:40, Alan Taylor via Tech1 wrote: ? If you dunk Hobnobs into your tea, you also get the health benefits of extra fibre in your diet. Chocolate is made from beans, therefore chocolate coated Hobnobs not only give you added fibre, but must count as one of your five per day. I?m surprised that chocolate Hobnobs dunked in a mug of tea aren?t universally recognised as being a superfood. Cheers Alan > On 17 Apr 2023, at 17:31, Doug Puddifoot via Tech1 wrote: > > ? > Well if this is true Tony must be immortal! > > Doug Puddifoot > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pat.heigham at amps.net Tue Apr 18 06:46:50 2023 From: pat.heigham at amps.net (Pat Heigham) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2023 12:46:50 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] BGT Message-ID: <18e6dae6-d327-2177-ff6b-6735395a3fad@amps.net> I know it's not a BBC programme, but I enjoy watching the crap acts being gonged off! The opening episode has engendered some adverse comments from viewers, mostly to do with the editing and one particular act, involving a guy playing a recorder stuffed up his nose. But no objections to a Japanese chap who blew out cake candles with a tube shoved up his bum! (OK, he wore tights!). The show's title is _Britain's_ Got Talent, so why were there a load of acts from America, Finland, Norway and Japan! Pat H -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From davidvbrunt at gmail.com Tue Apr 18 06:58:45 2023 From: davidvbrunt at gmail.com (David Brunt) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2023 12:58:45 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] BGT In-Reply-To: <18e6dae6-d327-2177-ff6b-6735395a3fad@amps.net> References: <18e6dae6-d327-2177-ff6b-6735395a3fad@amps.net> Message-ID: Cowell sees the bizarre acts on foreign versions of the show and gives them an invite and travel to the UK version. So, they're parachuted onto the TV shows filling a place a UK act could have taken. Everything's pre-planned by Cowell and the production team. Even who the winner will be before the first live TV episode. On Tue, 18 Apr 2023 at 12:47, Pat Heigham via Tech1 wrote: > > I know it's not a BBC programme, but I enjoy watching the crap acts being > gonged off! > > The opening episode has engendered some adverse comments from viewers, > mostly to do with the editing and one particular act, involving a guy playing > a recorder stuffed up his nose. > But no objections to a Japanese chap who blew out cake candles with a tube > shoved up his bum! (OK, he wore tights!). > > The show's title is Britain's Got Talent, so why were there a load of acts from > America, Finland, Norway and Japan! > > Pat H > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From saranewman at hotmail.com Tue Apr 18 07:28:20 2023 From: saranewman at hotmail.com (Sara Newman) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2023 12:28:20 +0000 Subject: [Tech1] BGT In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: A friend of mine son did the first series It was all decided before He suffered terribly as he felt so betrayed and used He was really talented and a great guy but it almost destroyed him ! Never watched any of cowells shows after that. No mistake that he was a seriously cunning operator but I wonder how many others he made to feel so bad. But as they say that?s entertainment Sarax Sent from my iPhone > On 18 Apr 2023, at 13:00, David Brunt via Tech1 wrote: > > ?Cowell sees the bizarre acts on foreign versions of the show and gives > them an invite and travel to the UK version. > > So, they're parachuted onto the TV shows filling a place a UK act > could have taken. > > Everything's pre-planned by Cowell and the production team. Even who > the winner will be before the first live TV episode. > >> On Tue, 18 Apr 2023 at 12:47, Pat Heigham via Tech1 >> wrote: >> >> I know it's not a BBC programme, but I enjoy watching the crap acts being >> gonged off! >> >> The opening episode has engendered some adverse comments from viewers, >> mostly to do with the editing and one particular act, involving a guy playing >> a recorder stuffed up his nose. >> But no objections to a Japanese chap who blew out cake candles with a tube >> shoved up his bum! (OK, he wore tights!). >> >> The show's title is Britain's Got Talent, so why were there a load of acts from >> America, Finland, Norway and Japan! >> >> Pat H >> >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From waresound at msn.com Tue Apr 18 07:32:37 2023 From: waresound at msn.com (Nick Ware) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2023 12:32:37 +0000 Subject: [Tech1] BGT In-Reply-To: <18e6dae6-d327-2177-ff6b-6735395a3fad@amps.net> References: <18e6dae6-d327-2177-ff6b-6735395a3fad@amps.net> Message-ID: Maybe Britain hasn?t got talent anymore. Some of the best, in my experience, is from America and Ukraine, though sadly prob not much hope for the latter atm. See if you like these: youtube.com/watch?v=An5a6h7vA00 and youtube.com/watch?v=P4_Bxqp2tQU Cheers, N. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad On 18 Apr 2023, at 12:47, Pat Heigham via Tech1 wrote: ? I know it's not a BBC programme, but I enjoy watching the crap acts being gonged off! The opening episode has engendered some adverse comments from viewers, mostly to do with the editing and one particular act, involving a guy playing a recorder stuffed up his nose. But no objections to a Japanese chap who blew out cake candles with a tube shoved up his bum! (OK, he wore tights!). The show's title is Britain's Got Talent, so why were there a load of acts from America, Finland, Norway and Japan! Pat H -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tuckergarth at mac.com Tue Apr 18 16:59:14 2023 From: tuckergarth at mac.com (garthtucker) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2023 22:59:14 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] An enquiry Message-ID: <00FCA6F6-FA1F-46CD-A027-1B1B6B2035FD@mac.com> I have an actor friend (Penny Ryder) who hails from Macclesfield, she has asked me if I knew a Bob Foley. I certainly did, I enjoyed Bob's company at the TVC. Does any one know of Bob?s whereabouts now? Garth From mibridge at mac.com Wed Apr 19 01:21:04 2023 From: mibridge at mac.com (Mike Giles) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2023 07:21:04 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] An enquiry In-Reply-To: <00FCA6F6-FA1F-46CD-A027-1B1B6B2035FD@mac.com> References: <00FCA6F6-FA1F-46CD-A027-1B1B6B2035FD@mac.com> Message-ID: <2858877D-05DF-4722-B82C-A252EE11030B@mac.com> If he hasn?t already seen this, I will ask Bob if he?s happy for his e-mail address to be shared with your friend, Garth. Mike G > On 18 Apr 2023, at 23:00, garthtucker via Tech1 wrote: > > ?I have an actor friend (Penny Ryder) who hails from Macclesfield, she has asked me if I knew a Bob Foley. I certainly did, I enjoyed Bob's company at the TVC. Does any one know of Bob?s whereabouts now? > > Garth > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From waresound at msn.com Wed Apr 19 02:41:16 2023 From: waresound at msn.com (Nick Ware) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2023 07:41:16 +0000 Subject: [Tech1] An enquiry In-Reply-To: <2858877D-05DF-4722-B82C-A252EE11030B@mac.com> References: <00FCA6F6-FA1F-46CD-A027-1B1B6B2035FD@mac.com> <2858877D-05DF-4722-B82C-A252EE11030B@mac.com> Message-ID: I have replied to Garth off list to this too. Nick Ware - sent from my iPad > On 19 Apr 2023, at 07:22, Mike Giles via Tech1 wrote: > > ?If he hasn?t already seen this, I will ask Bob if he?s happy for his e-mail address to be shared with your friend, Garth. > > Mike G > >> On 18 Apr 2023, at 23:00, garthtucker via Tech1 wrote: >> >> ?I have an actor friend (Penny Ryder) who hails from Macclesfield, she has asked me if I knew a Bob Foley. I certainly did, I enjoyed Bob's company at the TVC. Does any one know of Bob?s whereabouts now? >> >> Garth >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From tuckergarth at mac.com Wed Apr 19 13:04:40 2023 From: tuckergarth at mac.com (garthtucker) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2023 19:04:40 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Bob Message-ID: Many thanks Mike and Nick, Penny has just phoned me to say Bob has already made contact with her. Apparently Penny knew him when he was in short trousers. Garth From paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Wed Apr 19 13:17:27 2023 From: paul at pgtmedia.co.uk (Paul Thackray) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2023 19:17:27 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Bob In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <026b01d972eb$32763930$9762ab90$@pgtmedia.co.uk> I am not going to say Bob was always in short trousers, I am not going to even think it............Honest..... Paul Thackray PGT Media Consulting Ltd. 07802 243979 Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk Linkedin;?? http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ -----Original Message----- From: Tech1 On Behalf Of garthtucker via Tech1 Sent: 19 April 2023 19:05 To: Bernie Newnham Subject: [Tech1] Bob Many thanks Mike and Nick, Penny has just phoned me to say Bob has already made contact with her. Apparently Penny knew him when he was in short trousers. Garth -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From geoffletch at gmail.com Wed Apr 19 18:09:33 2023 From: geoffletch at gmail.com (Geoff Fletcher) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2023 00:09:33 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Bob In-Reply-To: <026b01d972eb$32763930$9762ab90$@pgtmedia.co.uk> References: <026b01d972eb$32763930$9762ab90$@pgtmedia.co.uk> Message-ID: Geoff F > On 19 Apr 2023, at 19:17, Paul Thackray via Tech1 wrote: > > I am not going to say Bob was always in short trousers, I am not going to > even think it............Honest..... > > Paul Thackray > PGT Media Consulting Ltd. > 07802 243979 > Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk > Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk > Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 > IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tech1 On Behalf Of garthtucker via > Tech1 > Sent: 19 April 2023 19:05 > To: Bernie Newnham > Subject: [Tech1] Bob > > Many thanks Mike and Nick, Penny has just phoned me to say Bob has already > made contact with her. Apparently Penny knew him when he was in short > trousers. > > Garth > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 640617 A12:03M TO19 Bob Foley eating Chipples on a hot afternoon, Wood Norton Hall, Evesham, Worcestershire copy.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 93425 bytes Desc: not available URL: From alanaudio at me.com Thu Apr 20 11:15:10 2023 From: alanaudio at me.com (Alan Taylor) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2023 17:15:10 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <0A2FAD5D-E7FB-4927-9D16-FD0958AFADA5@me.com> For anybody who might be interested and hasn?t already noticed, The Titfield Thunderbolt will be shown this evening on BBC Four at 22:30 Alan > On 16 Apr 2023, at 18:15, David Newbitt via Tech1 wrote: > > ?Absolutely fascinating read Alec - I greatly enjoyed it and marvelled at the prodigious amount of effort that went into the film. As to the film technology employed I find it jaw-dropping; getting results in those days was hard graft indeed. A wonderful compilation. > > Dave Newbitt. > > -----Original Message----- From: Graeme Wall via Tech1 > Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2023 7:39 PM > To: Alec Bray > Cc: Tech ops > Subject: Re: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting > > Lion wan?t at Shildon, she made an appearance at Rainhill a few years later for the Liverpool & Manchetser celebrations. > > I was at Shildon, working with the GWS sales team, we took our own bookshop! Got a perfect position to watch the cavalcade on the big day. > > > > > > > > > >> On 15 Apr 2023, at 19:24, Alec Bray via Tech1 wrote: >> >> Hi Dave, >> >> Thank you for your email! >> >> Yes, Simon's book - and other sources - are very clear about the origins of the story of The Titfield Thunderbolt. I did not include it as I was trying to keep the word count down - it will probably be published in several parts in our "Prospectus" as it is (and with far fewer pictures) - and the RSME audience would probably be more interested in the loco and the Techicolor process. >> >> Thank you for pointing out the Talyllyn Railway was the inspiration for the others here! >> >> Very best regards, Alec >> >> >> >> Sent from my mobile phone. Apologies for any strange autocorrections... >> >> On Sat, 15 Apr 2023, 18:41 Dave Buckley, wrote: >> Hi Alec, >> >> Many thanks for posting your item about the film, The Titfield Thunderbolt. >> >> Like a lot of members on in this group, this is a film I enjoy any time >> it comes on TV. >> >> I note that one of the references given for your article, is Simon >> Castens book 'On the trail of the Titfield Thunderbolt', a book I >> purchased straight away when it was published. I was a bit surprised >> that there was no mention though, that the storyline of the film was >> inspired by the early days of the preservation of the Talyllyn Railway >> in North Wales, although this is mentioned at the start of Simon's book. >> In fact at least on of the incidents in the film (where the water supply >> is sabotaged) is based on an actual situation on the TR, although the >> water tower wasn't shot at! >> >> There's another book about the film - The Titfield Thunderbolt, Now and >> Then - by Oliver Fosker, which goes through the film showing scenes from >> the film with photos showing the locations now. >> >> At one time, the engine used - Lion - was the oldest engine allowed to >> run on BR rails, and I had a railway book some time ago, with a photo >> showing Lion out on the main line, passing a colour light signal! I >> think it was something to do with the celebrations at Shildon in 1975. >> >> For a bit of nostalgia, have a look at... >> >> https://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/shildon_rail_150_celebrations/zjkmwnb >> >> Regards, >> >> Dave Buckley >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > > ? > Graeme Wall > > > > > > > > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From pat.heigham at amps.net Thu Apr 20 12:30:07 2023 From: pat.heigham at amps.net (Pat Heigham) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2023 18:30:07 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting In-Reply-To: <0A2FAD5D-E7FB-4927-9D16-FD0958AFADA5@me.com> References: <0A2FAD5D-E7FB-4927-9D16-FD0958AFADA5@me.com> Message-ID: Well spotted, Alan and thank you. Late transmission, so a job for the DVD recorder! Pat On 20/04/2023 17:15, Alan Taylor via Tech1 wrote: > For anybody who might be interested and hasn?t already noticed, The Titfield Thunderbolt will be shown this evening on BBC Four at 22:30 > > Alan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From peter.fox at zero51.force9.co.uk Thu Apr 20 13:49:43 2023 From: peter.fox at zero51.force9.co.uk (Peter Fox) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2023 19:49:43 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Good call Alan. Recorder at the ready. (22.30 is a bit late for me too) Peter Fox On 20 Apr 2023, at 18:30, Pat Heigham via Tech1 wrote: ? Well spotted, Alan and thank you. Late transmission, so a job for the DVD recorder! Pat On 20/04/2023 17:15, Alan Taylor via Tech1 wrote: > For anybody who might be interested and hasn?t already noticed, The Titfield Thunderbolt will be shown this evening on BBC Four at 22:30 > > Alan -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From davidvbrunt at gmail.com Thu Apr 20 14:10:03 2023 From: davidvbrunt at gmail.com (davidvbrunt) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2023 20:10:03 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <64418e0c.5d0a0220.56c66.52cd@mx.google.com> It'll be on BBC iplayer tomorrow.? if it isn't already.Sent from my Samsung Galaxy J3 2017 powered by Three -------- Original message --------From: Peter Fox via Tech1 Date: 20/04/2023 19:50 (GMT+00:00) To: Pat Heigham Cc: tech1 Subject: Re: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting Good call Alan. ?Recorder at the ready (22.30 is a bit late for me too)Peter FoxOn 20 Apr 2023, at 18:30, Pat Heigham via Tech1 wrote:? Well spotted, Alan and thank you. Late transmission, so a job for the DVD recorder! Pat On 20/04/2023 17:15, Alan Taylor via Tech1 wrote: For anybody who might be interested and hasn?t already noticed, The Titfield Thunderbolt will be shown this evening on BBC Four at 22:30 Alan -- Tech1 mailing listTech1 at tech-ops.co.ukhttp://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From peter.fox at zero51.force9.co.uk Thu Apr 20 16:30:41 2023 From: peter.fox at zero51.force9.co.uk (Peter Fox) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2023 22:30:41 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting In-Reply-To: <64418e0c.5d0a0220.56c66.52cd@mx.google.com> References: <64418e0c.5d0a0220.56c66.52cd@mx.google.com> Message-ID: We've been snookered Peter Fox On 20 Apr 2023, at 20:10, davidvbrunt wrote: ? It'll be on BBC iplayer tomorrow. if it isn't already. Sent from my Samsung Galaxy J3 2017 powered by Three -------- Original message -------- From: Peter Fox via Tech1 Date: 20/04/2023 19:50 (GMT+00:00) To: Pat Heigham Cc: tech1 Subject: Re: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting Good call Alan. Recorder at the ready (22.30 is a bit late for me too) Peter Fox On 20 Apr 2023, at 18:30, Pat Heigham via Tech1 wrote: ? Well spotted, Alan and thank you. Late transmission, so a job for the DVD recorder! Pat On 20/04/2023 17:15, Alan Taylor via Tech1 wrote: > For anybody who might be interested and hasn?t already noticed, The Titfield Thunderbolt will be shown this evening on BBC Four at 22:30 > > Alan -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alanaudio at me.com Thu Apr 20 17:43:49 2023 From: alanaudio at me.com (Alan Taylor) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2023 23:43:49 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <579BA65A-DDEC-46AD-91E0-5682CE03AA59@me.com> It looks to have been rescheduled for 00:20 for any night owls, or probably iPlayer tomorrow for people with more conventional sleeping habits. Alan > On 20 Apr 2023, at 22:31, Peter Fox via Tech1 wrote: > > ?We've been snookered > > Peter Fox > > On 20 Apr 2023, at 20:10, davidvbrunt wrote: > > ? > It'll be on BBC iplayer tomorrow. if it isn't already. > > > > Sent from my Samsung Galaxy J3 2017 powered by Three > > > -------- Original message -------- > From: Peter Fox via Tech1 > Date: 20/04/2023 19:50 (GMT+00:00) > To: Pat Heigham > Cc: tech1 > Subject: Re: [Tech1] Thunderbolt and Lighting > > Good call Alan. Recorder at the ready (22.30 is a bit late for me too) > > Peter Fox > > On 20 Apr 2023, at 18:30, Pat Heigham via Tech1 wrote: > > ? > Well spotted, Alan and thank you. > > Late transmission, so a job for the DVD recorder! > > Pat > > On 20/04/2023 17:15, Alan Taylor via Tech1 wrote: >> For anybody who might be interested and hasn?t already noticed, The Titfield Thunderbolt will be shown this evening on BBC Four at 22:30 >> >> Alan > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jpbarlow at btopenworld.com Fri Apr 21 13:48:52 2023 From: jpbarlow at btopenworld.com (John Barlow) Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2023 19:48:52 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Geoff Feld Funeral Message-ID: <032c01d97481$eb3061c0$c1912540$@btopenworld.com> Garth and I recently asked, via this Tech Ops website and facebook, for pictures and anecdotes about Geoff Feld for possible inclusion in his Eulogy and were overwhelmed by the response. Time did not allow for anything like the hundred or so emails and texts we received but we will bring all of these together and present them to his family. Thank you all of you that contributed. The funeral service itself was made available online and is available to view with this link: Geoff Feld Funeral Best wishes to all JohnB -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jpbarlow at btopenworld.com Sat Apr 22 10:30:57 2023 From: jpbarlow at btopenworld.com (John Barlow) Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2023 16:30:57 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Geoff Feld Funeral Message-ID: <002d01d9752f$6f73e800$4e5bb800$@btopenworld.com> Garth and I recently asked, via this Tech Ops forum and facebook, for pictures and anecdotes about Geoff Feld for possible inclusion in his Eulogy and were overwhelmed by the response. Time did not allow for anything like the hundred or so emails and texts we received but we will bring all of these together and present them to his family. Thank you all of you that contributed. The funeral service itself was made available online and is available to view with this link: Geoff Feld Funeral Best wishes to all. JohnB -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dnewbitt at fireflyuk.net Sat Apr 22 11:47:36 2023 From: dnewbitt at fireflyuk.net (David Newbitt) Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2023 17:47:36 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Geoff Feld Funeral In-Reply-To: <032c01d97481$eb3061c0$c1912540$@btopenworld.com> References: <032c01d97481$eb3061c0$c1912540$@btopenworld.com> Message-ID: Thank you for posting these details John. I downloaded the MP4 video (about 360 MB) and watched it right through. Time well spent and I feel grateful to have had the opportunity to see it. As I left in 1979 all my memories of colleagues are from the time well before any of us became old. In Geoff?s case, because he had such a warm friendly face and that mischievous unforgettable smile, I found it hard watching some of those photos of him in his last years as I had no picture in my mind of anything later than him as he was in his prime. All the character ingredients still there of course but I kept wanting to go back to seeing him at his best. I feel the same about my shaving mirror! I thought at the conclusion of the service, seeing the coffin being borne into the light and the woodland was uplifting, a feeling quite dissimilar to my usual emotions watching coffins disappear with curtains closing behind. May he rest in peace in such natural surroundings. Dave Newbitt. From: John Barlow via Tech1 Sent: Friday, April 21, 2023 7:48 PM To: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk Subject: [Tech1] Geoff Feld Funeral Garth and I recently asked, via this Tech Ops website and facebook, for pictures and anecdotes about Geoff Feld for possible inclusion in his Eulogy and were overwhelmed by the response. Time did not allow for anything like the hundred or so emails and texts we received but we will bring all of these together and present them to his family. Thank you all of you that contributed. The funeral service itself was made available online and is available to view with this link: Geoff Feld Funeral Best wishes to all JohnB -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chris at chriswoolf.co.uk Sun Apr 23 09:37:31 2023 From: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk (Chris Woolf) Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2023 15:37:31 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: References: <032c01d97481$eb3061c0$c1912540$@btopenworld.com> Message-ID: <1e96d573-caa9-afaa-bc6f-29a17fa109a8@chriswoolf.co.uk> So.... who didn't get an alert? I run an oldish Galaxy 8? (Android 9), which theoretically should be able to receive the alert (though you do have to actually turn the Emergency Broadcast tab on). I'm within acceptable range of a 4G mast (which I think is run by 3). And I'm in range of my own wifi too. But not a hint of a message or alert.? And I don't think I'm alone. Chris Woolf -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Sun Apr 23 09:44:57 2023 From: paul at pgtmedia.co.uk (paul at pgtmedia.co.uk) Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2023 15:44:57 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <1e96d573-caa9-afaa-bc6f-29a17fa109a8@chriswoolf.co.uk> Message-ID: <8p7uj46r1tjoa2tufvt0emb0.1682261097297@pgtmedia.co.uk> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From david at davidtaylorsound.co.uk Sun Apr 23 09:45:06 2023 From: david at davidtaylorsound.co.uk (David Taylor) Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2023 15:45:06 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <1e96d573-caa9-afaa-bc6f-29a17fa109a8@chriswoolf.co.uk> References: <032c01d97481$eb3061c0$c1912540$@btopenworld.com> <1e96d573-caa9-afaa-bc6f-29a17fa109a8@chriswoolf.co.uk> Message-ID: I got 3 - 3pm, 3.10 and 3.15. So I switched my phone off. On Sun, 23 Apr 2023 at 15:38, Chris Woolf via Tech1 wrote: > So.... who didn't get an alert? > > I run an oldish Galaxy 8 (Android 9), which theoretically should be able > to receive the alert (though you do have to actually turn the Emergency > Broadcast tab on). I'm within acceptable range of a 4G mast (which I think > is run by 3). And I'm in range of my own wifi too. > > But not a hint of a message or alert. And I don't think I'm alone. > > Chris Woolf > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From barry-wilkinson at sky.com Sun Apr 23 09:54:17 2023 From: barry-wilkinson at sky.com (B Wilkinson) Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2023 15:54:17 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <1e96d573-caa9-afaa-bc6f-29a17fa109a8@chriswoolf.co.uk> References: <1e96d573-caa9-afaa-bc6f-29a17fa109a8@chriswoolf.co.uk> Message-ID: <5D006DAD-8768-459A-915A-DB858BB243B5@sky.com> Me neither, I was away from home on 3G?.( What?s 4G????) Sent from my iPad > On 23 Apr 2023, at 15:38, Chris Woolf via Tech1 wrote: > > ? > So.... who didn't get an alert? > > I run an oldish Galaxy 8 (Android 9), which theoretically should be able to receive the alert (though you do have to actually turn the Emergency Broadcast tab on). I'm within acceptable range of a 4G mast (which I think is run by 3). And I'm in range of my own wifi too. > > But not a hint of a message or alert. And I don't think I'm alone. > > Chris Woolf > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chris at chriswoolf.co.uk Sun Apr 23 09:57:26 2023 From: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk (Chris Woolf) Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2023 15:57:26 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <8p7uj46r1tjoa2tufvt0emb0.1682261097297@pgtmedia.co.uk> References: <8p7uj46r1tjoa2tufvt0emb0.1682261097297@pgtmedia.co.uk> Message-ID: Why do I suspect another gov.uk cock-up, rather like the Track & Trace? Chris Woolf On 23/04/2023 15:44, paul at pgtmedia.co.uk wrote: > > I am running the latest Android on a Samsung that's only 12 months old > on O2.? Nothing! > > Paul Thackray > > PGT Media Consulting Ltd. > > +44 7802 243979 > > Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk > > Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk > > Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 > > IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ > > *From:* tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > *Sent:* 23 April 2023 15:38 > *To:* tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > *Reply to:* chris at chriswoolf.co.uk > *Subject:* Re: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert > > > So.... who didn't get an alert? > > I run an oldish Galaxy 8? (Android 9), which theoretically should be > able to receive the alert (though you do have to actually turn the > Emergency Broadcast tab on). I'm within acceptable range of a 4G mast > (which I think is run by 3). And I'm in range of my own wifi too. > > But not a hint of a message or alert.? And I don't think I'm alone. > > Chris Woolf > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Sun Apr 23 10:17:11 2023 From: paul at pgtmedia.co.uk (paul at pgtmedia.co.uk) Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2023 16:17:11 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From barry-wilkinson at sky.com Sun Apr 23 10:31:18 2023 From: barry-wilkinson at sky.com (B Wilkinson) Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2023 16:31:18 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1B74047B-55BE-4117-B1C2-E9B55F3FA254@sky.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chris at chriswoolf.co.uk Sun Apr 23 10:42:33 2023 From: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk (Chris Woolf) Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2023 16:42:33 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <22e05ce1-0b80-e68a-ae32-1f6dcdf5e2a5@chriswoolf.co.uk> Indeed, only 4/5G. But I took care to be outside and to have an acceptable 4G signal. However half Cornwall (and lots of other rural areas) falls back to 3G in many areas, and inside most houses. These are, of course, the most likely people to need an alert, since they are most spread out and hard to contact by other means. Some similarities to Elon's Starship trial. Splendid rocket, but it rather seems they didn't spend enough time on the launch pad, so it was crippled before it ever took off. Neither alert message nor Starship seem reliable enough to abandon this planet just yet;} Chris W On 23/04/2023 16:17, paul at pgtmedia.co.uk wrote: > Just discovered it only works for 4G and 5G. If your network is patchy > in the area you are in it falls back to 3G , then will not work! > > Do you think it's like The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, the > abandon planet message only goes to the useless people that everyone > else wants rid of? > > Paul Thackray > > PGT Media Consulting Ltd. > > +44 7802 243979 > > Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk > > Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk > > Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 > > IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ > > *From:* chris at chriswoolf.co.uk > *Sent:* 23 April 2023 15:57 > *To:* paul at pgtmedia.co.uk; tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > *Reply to:* chris at chriswoolf.co.uk > *Subject:* Re: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert > > > Why do I suspect another gov.uk cock-up, rather like > the Track ????? & Trace? > > Chris Woolf > > > On 23/04/2023 15:44, paul at pgtmedia.co.uk wrote: >> >> I am running the latest Android on a Samsung that's only 12 months >> old on O2.? Nothing! >> >> Paul Thackray >> >> PGT Media Consulting Ltd. >> >> +44 7802 243979 >> >> Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk >> >> Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk >> >> Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 >> >> IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ >> >> *From:* tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> *Sent:* 23 April 2023 15:38 >> *To:* tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> *Reply to:* chris at chriswoolf.co.uk >> *Subject:* Re: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert >> >> >> So.... who didn't get an alert? >> >> I run an oldish Galaxy 8? (Android 9), which theoretically should be >> able to receive the alert (though you do have to actually turn the >> Emergency Broadcast tab on). I'm within acceptable range of a 4G mast >> (which I think is run by 3). And I'm in range of my own wifi too. >> >> But not a hint of a message or alert.? And I don't think I'm alone. >> >> Chris Woolf >> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From graeme.wall at icloud.com Sun Apr 23 11:26:54 2023 From: graeme.wall at icloud.com (Graeme Wall) Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2023 17:26:54 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <8p7uj46r1tjoa2tufvt0emb0.1682261097297@pgtmedia.co.uk> References: <8p7uj46r1tjoa2tufvt0emb0.1682261097297@pgtmedia.co.uk> Message-ID: <43C0C80E-A8BD-4D7E-9B25-33B4EE47E478@icloud.com> Apparently anyone using Three didn?t get it. > On 23 Apr 2023, at 15:44, paul--- via Tech1 wrote: > > > I am running the latest Android on a Samsung that's only 12 months old on O2. Nothing! > Paul Thackray > > PGT Media Consulting Ltd. > +44 7802 243979 > Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk > > Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk > Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 > IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ > From: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > Sent: 23 April 2023 15:38 > To: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > Reply to: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk > Subject: Re: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert > So.... who didn't get an alert? > I run an oldish Galaxy 8 (Android 9), which theoretically should be able to receive the alert (though you do have to actually turn the Emergency Broadcast tab on). I'm within acceptable range of a 4G mast (which I think is run by 3). And I'm in range of my own wifi too. > But not a hint of a message or alert. And I don't think I'm alone. > Chris Woolf > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk ? Graeme Wall From jnottage.jn at googlemail.com Sun Apr 23 12:02:48 2023 From: jnottage.jn at googlemail.com (John Nottage) Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2023 18:02:48 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <43C0C80E-A8BD-4D7E-9B25-33B4EE47E478@icloud.com> References: <8p7uj46r1tjoa2tufvt0emb0.1682261097297@pgtmedia.co.uk> <43C0C80E-A8BD-4D7E-9B25-33B4EE47E478@icloud.com> Message-ID: <19b7e5d6-9716-6bd2-f7f3-8eb88ffabac6@googlemail.com> I don't know if mine would have worked. I switched the phone to Airplane mode, then turned it off too, just in case: we were in the Aldeburgh Cinema at a screening of the Vermeer Exhibition from the Rijksmuseum. They asked everyone to turn their phones off so as not to spoil the show. Of course, at about 3pm, several phones sounded the alert anyway! Fantastic exhibition, excellently covered. John Nottage On 23/04/2023 17:26, Graeme Wall via Tech1 wrote: > Apparently anyone using Three didn?t get it. > >> On 23 Apr 2023, at 15:44, paul--- via Tech1 wrote: >> >> >> I am running the latest Android on a Samsung that's only 12 months old on O2. Nothing! >> Paul Thackray >> >> PGT Media Consulting Ltd. >> +44 7802 243979 >> Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk >> >> Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk >> Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 >> IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ >> From: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> Sent: 23 April 2023 15:38 >> To: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> Reply to: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk >> Subject: Re: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert >> So.... who didn't get an alert? >> I run an oldish Galaxy 8 (Android 9), which theoretically should be able to receive the alert (though you do have to actually turn the Emergency Broadcast tab on). I'm within acceptable range of a 4G mast (which I think is run by 3). And I'm in range of my own wifi too. >> But not a hint of a message or alert. And I don't think I'm alone. >> Chris Woolf >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > > ? > Graeme Wall > > > From gary_critcher at yahoo.com Sun Apr 23 12:10:53 2023 From: gary_critcher at yahoo.com (Gary Critcher) Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2023 17:10:53 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <19b7e5d6-9716-6bd2-f7f3-8eb88ffabac6@googlemail.com> References: <8p7uj46r1tjoa2tufvt0emb0.1682261097297@pgtmedia.co.uk> <43C0C80E-A8BD-4D7E-9B25-33B4EE47E478@icloud.com> <19b7e5d6-9716-6bd2-f7f3-8eb88ffabac6@googlemail.com> Message-ID: <552703566.10775060.1682269853086@mail.yahoo.com> ? ?Here in Nairobi both my wife and I still have our UK phones, I thought we would both get the alert but nothing on either. ? ?ATB,Gary C -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hughsnape at talktalk.net Sun Apr 23 19:22:52 2023 From: hughsnape at talktalk.net (Hugh Snape) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 01:22:52 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <1B74047B-55BE-4117-B1C2-E9B55F3FA254@sky.com> References: <1B74047B-55BE-4117-B1C2-E9B55F3FA254@sky.com> Message-ID: <3E5877FA-8FE7-47C9-A334-E01508E41ED9@talktalk.net> No, I didn?t get it, was watching out for our two girls in the London Marathon and all the ?phones in the crowd around me went off but not mine. It?s a first series iPhone SE on the Smarty network which is a flavour of 3. Never mind both girls finished unscathed! Hugh > On 23 Apr 2023, at 16:31, B Wilkinson via Tech1 wrote: > > ?I wish! > All the young uns with their 5G iPhones should get the message which should obviously be > ? Don?t panic , don?t panic Mr Mannering? > Or ? You have one minute to find somewhere safe from the 500 nukes coming from Russia/ North Korea / Iran ? > Or ? If you can read this you are the last person alive on the planet?Have a nice day? > Or ?Don?t forget the 75% off sale at furniture land tomorrow? > Or ? Diane Abbot is going to be the next prime minister, please stay calm and hide under the nearest table, bend over and kiss your ass goodbye? > > Other Prime ministers are available , but they are all useless! > Enough for one afternoon. > > Sent from my iPad > >>> On 23 Apr 2023, at 16:17, paul--- via Tech1 wrote: >>> >> ? >> Just discovered it only works for 4G and 5G. If your network is patchy in the area you are in it falls back to 3G , then will not work! >> >> Do you think it's like The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, the abandon planet message only goes to the useless people that everyone else wants rid of? >> >> Paul Thackray >> >> >> >> PGT Media Consulting Ltd. >> >> +44 7802 243979 >> >> Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk >> >> >> >> Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk >> >> Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 >> >> IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ >> >> From: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk >> Sent: 23 April 2023 15:57 >> To: paul at pgtmedia.co.uk; tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> Reply to: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk >> Subject: Re: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert >> >> Why do I suspect another gov.uk cock-up, rather like the Track & Trace? >> >> Chris Woolf >> >> >> >> On 23/04/2023 15:44, paul at pgtmedia.co.uk wrote: >>> >>> I am running the latest Android on a Samsung that's only 12 months old on O2. Nothing! >>> Paul Thackray >>> >>> >>> >>> PGT Media Consulting Ltd. >>> >>> +44 7802 243979 >>> >>> Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk >>> >>> >>> >>> Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk >>> >>> Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 >>> >>> IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ >>> >>> From: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >>> Sent: 23 April 2023 15:38 >>> To: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >>> Reply to: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk >>> Subject: Re: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert >>> >>> So.... who didn't get an alert? >>> >>> I run an oldish Galaxy 8 (Android 9), which theoretically should be able to receive the alert (though you do have to actually turn the Emergency Broadcast tab on). I'm within acceptable range of a 4G mast (which I think is run by 3). And I'm in range of my own wifi too. >>> >>> But not a hint of a message or alert. And I don't think I'm alone. >>> >>> Chris Woolf >>> >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image0.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 4424271 bytes Desc: not available URL: From doug at puddifoot.me Mon Apr 24 03:52:59 2023 From: doug at puddifoot.me (Doug Puddifoot) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 09:52:59 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert Message-ID: As I understand it, it is not sent as text message to individual phone numbers, that would swamp the system. Each phone tower broadcasts a single message which every phone in its area should be able to receive. Doug Puddifoot On 23 April 2023, at 18:10, Gary Critcher via Tech1 wrote: ? ?Here in Nairobi both my wife and I still have our UK phones, I thought we would both get the alert but nothing on either. ? ?ATB, Gary C -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From paul at pgtmedia.co.uk Mon Apr 24 03:57:53 2023 From: paul at pgtmedia.co.uk (paul at pgtmedia.co.uk) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 09:57:53 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <32m46vi2qgtcau8vujbp1gbg.1682326673247@pgtmedia.co.uk> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alanaudio at me.com Mon Apr 24 04:03:03 2023 From: alanaudio at me.com (Alan Taylor) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 10:03:03 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <552703566.10775060.1682269853086@mail.yahoo.com> References: <552703566.10775060.1682269853086@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <510FC3CF-6FF1-495D-A0B6-6F70FF9168AF@me.com> The alert is generated by the network provider. If you are not connected to a UK network, you won?t get the alert, which is fair enough because you won?t be in the area where the warning applies to if it were for real. One of Janet?s kids was travelling overseas with his UK phone and didn?t get the alert either. The people operating the Three network must have messed up big time because it didn?t work on their network, but did on the others. That?s exactly why systems like this need to be tested if you want to rely on them when there is a real emergency. Alan > On 23 Apr 2023, at 18:11, Gary Critcher via Tech1 wrote: > > ? > Here in Nairobi both my wife and I still have our UK phones, I thought we would both get the alert but nothing on either. > > ATB, > Gary C > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From peter.neill at icloud.com Mon Apr 24 04:05:34 2023 From: peter.neill at icloud.com (Peter Neill) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 10:05:34 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <32m46vi2qgtcau8vujbp1gbg.1682326673247@pgtmedia.co.uk> References: <32m46vi2qgtcau8vujbp1gbg.1682326673247@pgtmedia.co.uk> Message-ID: <99D9239C-EEAB-476F-99E9-01936BF1A624@icloud.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gary_critcher at yahoo.com Mon Apr 24 04:06:53 2023 From: gary_critcher at yahoo.com (Gary Critcher) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 09:06:53 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <510FC3CF-6FF1-495D-A0B6-6F70FF9168AF@me.com> References: <552703566.10775060.1682269853086@mail.yahoo.com> <510FC3CF-6FF1-495D-A0B6-6F70FF9168AF@me.com> Message-ID: <1066253247.1740484.1682327213943@mail.yahoo.com> Thanks for the replies - they explained it all, ta. On Monday, 24 April 2023 at 02:03:47 GMT-7, Alan Taylor via Tech1 wrote: The alert is generated by the network provider. ?If you are not connected to a UK network, you won?t get the alert, which is fair enough because you won?t be in the area where the warning applies to if it were for real. One of Janet?s kids was travelling overseas with his UK phone and didn?t get the alert either. The people operating the Three network must have messed up big time because it didn?t work on their network, but did on the others. ?That?s exactly why systems like this need to be tested if you want to rely on them when there is a real emergency. Alan On 23 Apr 2023, at 18:11, Gary Critcher via Tech1 wrote: ?? ?Here in Nairobi both my wife and I still have our UK phones, I thought we would both get the alert but nothing on either. ? ?ATB,Gary C-- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nick at nickway.co.uk Mon Apr 24 04:28:00 2023 From: nick at nickway.co.uk (Nick Way) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 10:28:00 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <510FC3CF-6FF1-495D-A0B6-6F70FF9168AF@me.com> References: <552703566.10775060.1682269853086@mail.yahoo.com> <510FC3CF-6FF1-495D-A0B6-6F70FF9168AF@me.com> Message-ID: <1690713185.1840426.1682328480190@email.ionos.co.uk> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chris at chriswoolf.co.uk Mon Apr 24 04:35:17 2023 From: chris at chriswoolf.co.uk (Chris Woolf) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 10:35:17 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <99D9239C-EEAB-476F-99E9-01936BF1A624@icloud.com> References: <32m46vi2qgtcau8vujbp1gbg.1682326673247@pgtmedia.co.uk> <99D9239C-EEAB-476F-99E9-01936BF1A624@icloud.com> Message-ID: On 24/04/2023 10:05, Peter Neill via Tech1 wrote: > As I understand it, it is broadcast indiscriminately to any phone - UK > or otherwise within the range of a cell transmitter. I believe it can > be tailored down to a single transmitter. Indeed - that's right. The .gov website that deals with the alerts allows you to do a survey of whether the alert worked. But the questions only go as far as did you receive the alert, and (essentially) was your mobile turned on. No questions about what phone you have, or what network you are hung on, and where. They might be able to work some of that out if you reply using the same device, but I get the feeling that they aren't interested in any of that. Track and Trace all over again. Chris Woolf From pat.heigham at amps.net Mon Apr 24 05:11:05 2023 From: pat.heigham at amps.net (Pat Heigham) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 11:11:05 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <1e96d573-caa9-afaa-bc6f-29a17fa109a8@chriswoolf.co.uk> References: <032c01d97481$eb3061c0$c1912540$@btopenworld.com> <1e96d573-caa9-afaa-bc6f-29a17fa109a8@chriswoolf.co.uk> Message-ID: <78d4957c-c82d-88d0-9014-ced78d5dfb3f@amps.net> I just wonder at the tens of thousands that this inept government has spent on trying to install something that doesn't work. Let's go back to WW2 handwound sirens on wooden towers! Why should we be 'ordered' to have Internet and smartphones? Where's my free government issue of the latter? Oh! and the ddiplomatic people were evacuated pdq from Sudan, and blow any other Brits. Pat H On 23/04/2023 15:37, Chris Woolf via Tech1 wrote: > > So.... who didn't get an alert? > > I run an oldish Galaxy 8? (Android 9), which theoretically should be > able to receive the alert (though you do have to actually turn the > Emergency Broadcast tab on). I'm within acceptable range of a 4G mast > (which I think is run by 3). And I'm in range of my own wifi too. > > But not a hint of a message or alert.? And I don't think I'm alone. > > Chris Woolf > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From graeme.wall at icloud.com Mon Apr 24 06:45:35 2023 From: graeme.wall at icloud.com (Graeme Wall) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 12:45:35 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <32m46vi2qgtcau8vujbp1gbg.1682326673247@pgtmedia.co.uk> References: <32m46vi2qgtcau8vujbp1gbg.1682326673247@pgtmedia.co.uk> Message-ID: It can be targeted, they did an initial test in the Reading area some time back. I just happened to be in te town that day so got it. > On 24 Apr 2023, at 09:57, paul--- via Tech1 wrote: > > > I suspect it can be targeted e.g. just yorkshire. It will never work outside the UK? > Paul Thackray > > PGT Media Consulting Ltd. > +44 7802 243979 > Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk > > Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk > Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 > IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ > From: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > Sent: 24 April 2023 09:53 > To: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > Reply to: doug at puddifoot.me > Subject: Re: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert > As I understand it, it is not sent as text message to individual phone numbers, that would swamp the system. Each phone tower broadcasts a single message which every phone in its area should be able to receive. > Doug Puddifoot > > > On 23 April 2023, at 18:10, Gary Critcher via Tech1 wrote: > > > Here in Nairobi both my wife and I still have our UK phones, I thought we would both get the alert but nothing on either. > > ATB, > Gary C > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk ? Graeme Wall From peter.neill at icloud.com Mon Apr 24 08:30:54 2023 From: peter.neill at icloud.com (Peter Neill) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 14:30:54 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Martin Kisner Message-ID: <6ED3CB61-3EBE-464F-8598-FE4B1AF3CC8C@icloud.com> Simon Kisner has just posted on Facebook that his dad, Martin has died. No further details yet. Peter Neill Sent from my iPhone. Apologies for typos and autocorruptions. From plowmandave44 at gmail.com Mon Apr 24 12:48:27 2023 From: plowmandave44 at gmail.com (Dave Plowman) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 18:48:27 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Android phones and Barclays Bank. Message-ID: I'd be surprised if I'm the only one with this combination. And frustrated by Barclay's App being very flaky with touch payments. And of course the impossibility of talking to a human who has the answer, too. The good news is you can now use your debit card with Google Pay. And this works flawlessly. Only happened across this on FB. Barclays didn't find it worth telling me direct. -- Dave Plowman London, SW From philiptyler at me.com Mon Apr 24 13:26:46 2023 From: philiptyler at me.com (Philip Tyler) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 21:26:46 +0300 Subject: [Tech1] Android phones and Barclays Bank. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8C83474F-FFB9-438D-B5A5-88AA803B3041@me.com> Works brilliantly on an Apple iPhone. Philip and Bee https://www.flickriver.com/photos/philthebirdbrain/popular-interesting/ > On 24 Apr 2023, at 20:49, Dave Plowman via Tech1 wrote: > > ?I'd be surprised if I'm the only one with this combination. And frustrated by Barclay's App being very flaky with touch payments. And of course the impossibility of talking to a human who has the answer, too. > The good news is you can now use your debit card with Google Pay. And this works flawlessly. Only happened across this on FB. Barclays didn't find it worth telling me direct. > -- > Dave Plowman > London, SW > > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From plowmandave44 at gmail.com Mon Apr 24 13:30:11 2023 From: plowmandave44 at gmail.com (Dave Plowman) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 19:30:11 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Android phones and Barclays Bank. In-Reply-To: <8C83474F-FFB9-438D-B5A5-88AA803B3041@me.com> References: <8C83474F-FFB9-438D-B5A5-88AA803B3041@me.com> Message-ID: All the more reason it should work with Android too. On 24/04/2023 19:26, Philip Tyler wrote: > Works brilliantly on an Apple iPhone. > > Philip and Bee > > https://www.flickriver.com/photos/philthebirdbrain/popular-interesting/ > > >> On 24 Apr 2023, at 20:49, Dave Plowman via Tech1 >> wrote: >> >> ?I'd be surprised if I'm the only one with this combination. And >> frustrated by Barclay's App being very flaky with touch payments. And >> of course the impossibility of talking to a human who has the answer, too. >> The good news is you can now use your debit card with Google Pay. And >> this works flawlessly. Only happened across this on FB. Barclays >> didn't find it worth telling me direct. >> -- >> Dave Plowman >> London, SW >> >> -- >> Tech1 mailing list >> Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk >> http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -- Dave Plowman London, SW From peter.fox at zero51.force9.co.uk Mon Apr 24 15:56:59 2023 From: peter.fox at zero51.force9.co.uk (Peter Fox) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 21:56:59 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <766A76B8-ADB3-4439-BAF8-5C2649E163FA@zero51.force9.co.uk> I am told, by "er indoors" that its already well established for local use in New Zealand, popular for tremors, USA for missing kids and in Australia too. In that case for imminent shortages of XXXX (Joke... I know Aussies wouldn't dream of actually drinking that stuff) Peter Fox On 24 Apr 2023, at 12:46, Graeme Wall via Tech1 wrote: ?It can be targeted, they did an initial test in the Reading area some time back. I just happened to be in te town that day so got it. > On 24 Apr 2023, at 09:57, paul--- via Tech1 wrote: > > > I suspect it can be targeted e.g. just yorkshire. It will never work outside the UK? > Paul Thackray > > PGT Media Consulting Ltd. > +44 7802 243979 > Mail; paul at pgtmedia.co.uk > > Web; http://www.pgtmedia.co.uk > Linkedin; http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/paul-thackray/19/379/746 > IMDB; http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1488554/ > From: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > Sent: 24 April 2023 09:53 > To: tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > Reply to: doug at puddifoot.me > Subject: Re: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert > As I understand it, it is not sent as text message to individual phone numbers, that would swamp the system. Each phone tower broadcasts a single message which every phone in its area should be able to receive. > Doug Puddifoot > > > On 23 April 2023, at 18:10, Gary Critcher via Tech1 wrote: > > > Here in Nairobi both my wife and I still have our UK phones, I thought we would both get the alert but nothing on either. > > ATB, > Gary C > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk ? Graeme Wall -- Tech1 mailing list Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk From peter.neill at icloud.com Mon Apr 24 16:11:17 2023 From: peter.neill at icloud.com (Peter Neill) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2023 22:11:17 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Emergency broadcast alert In-Reply-To: <766A76B8-ADB3-4439-BAF8-5C2649E163FA@zero51.force9.co.uk> References: <766A76B8-ADB3-4439-BAF8-5C2649E163FA@zero51.force9.co.uk> Message-ID: <163FB6FD-0C3A-4183-8F8D-437EC8E183D6@icloud.com> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image0.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 84684 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- From phider at gmx.com Wed Apr 26 08:22:02 2023 From: phider at gmx.com (phider) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2023 14:22:02 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Geoff Feld Message-ID: <1M9Wyy-1pxArv0g1k-005brB@mail.gmx.net> I just came across this photo from 2010 of Geoff and John Barlow.Always the smile.Regards?Peter Hider?Sent from my Galaxy -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: P1080700.JPG Type: image/jpeg Size: 463174 bytes Desc: not available URL: From loizbale at gmail.com Wed Apr 26 08:51:39 2023 From: loizbale at gmail.com (Loiz Bale) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2023 14:51:39 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Stan Message-ID: Dear Robin how kind it was of you to send a card to me. Your wonderful words of friendship mean a lot at this sad time. I was so lucky to have such a lovely man. Funeral arrangements : May 22nd 11.45 at Hampden Chapel at Amersham Crematorium and afterwards at The Gate Bryant?s Bottom . Thanks so much again Robin. Loiz Sent from my iPhone From dnewbitt at fireflyuk.net Thu Apr 27 12:38:16 2023 From: dnewbitt at fireflyuk.net (David Newbitt) Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2023 18:38:16 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Updated Highway Code rules. Message-ID: This was included in a clip from the Daily Express featured on MSN today:- ?Cyclists were also reminded that they can ride to abreast, as has always been the case and which can be safer in large groups or with children.? (I presume we can read ?two? for ?to?) Many years ago when it was commonplace for Police cars on patrol to issue guidance through megaphones whilst on the move, I was riding two-abreast with a school-mate when one such came up behind us instructing ?in the interests of road safety it is inadvisable to ride two-abreast?. I wonder if there are many like me (in ignorance of modern re-thinking) who have at times felt irritated at having to drive behind duos for very extended distances, thinking they were being deliberately obstructive? It seems they were merely exercising their rights. Dave Newbitt. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mibridge at mac.com Thu Apr 27 14:32:37 2023 From: mibridge at mac.com (Mike Giles) Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2023 20:32:37 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Updated Highway Code rules. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <503FA446-4F70-4AAD-A628-CCEDAC131B39@mac.com> It?s the result of confused and incomplete thinking by the powers that be ~ riding two abreast may be reasonable on a dual carriageway, but makes no sense on single carriageways when there is other traffic in evidence, particularly on narrow country lanes, but try telling big butch MAMILs that! Personally, I would always prefer self-preservation over pointless bravado. Mike G > On 27 Apr 2023, at 18:38, David Newbitt via Tech1 wrote: > > This was included in a clip from the Daily Express featured on MSN today:- > > ?Cyclists were also reminded that they can ride to abreast, as has always been the case and which can be safer in large groups or with children.? (I presume we can read ?two? for ?to?) > > Many years ago when it was commonplace for Police cars on patrol to issue guidance through megaphones whilst on the move, I was riding two-abreast with a school-mate when one such came up behind us instructing ?in the interests of road safety it is inadvisable to ride two-abreast?. > > I wonder if there are many like me (in ignorance of modern re-thinking) who have at times felt irritated at having to drive behind duos for very extended distances, thinking they were being deliberately obstructive? It seems they were merely exercising their rights. > > Dave Newbitt. > -- > Tech1 mailing list > Tech1 at tech-ops.co.uk > http://tech-ops.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/tech1_tech-ops.co.uk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alawrance1 at me.com Sun Apr 30 09:16:57 2023 From: alawrance1 at me.com (Alasdair Lawrance) Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2023 15:16:57 +0100 Subject: [Tech1] Artistes for the 'Coronation Concert' Message-ID: I see that more artistes have been booked by the BBC for the Concert. The announcement is on the Beeb website, and authored by one Kate Philips, who is apparently "Director of Unscripted". So our ex-employer has lost any understanding of irony.... Alasdair Lawrance alawrance1 at me.com Don?t blame me, I voted Remain. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From robsuth at live.com Mon Apr 10 07:17:53 2023 From: robsuth at live.com (Robin Sutherland) Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2023 12:17:53 -0000 Subject: [Tech1] Robin Sutherland - Please note my change of email address Message-ID: Hi all Please be aware that I am changing my principal email address from robin.sutherland at ukgateway.net to robsuth at live.com. Both will be active for some time to come but I have been having increasing difficulties with TalkTalk in keeping the old one going and finally decided to make the change. I?d be grateful if you could amend your contacts lists. Best wishes Robin